trial that could be used against officer gordon and white, for instance. so i think that lends itself to fairness on a purely evidentiary level. . number two, i do think the judge -- judge billy, he may have more experience with judge barry williams so he would be able to tell us about him but i think we are in a position to have a fair judge. it is so important, melissa, i think to have a fair judge because that's where you get your rulings. if i am trying to put in evidence my prior relationship with freddie gray and the defense wants it in the prosecution doesn't, that's up to the judge to say, wait a minute, this is irrelevant, or it is relevant to the officer's state of mind when dealing with freddie gray. >> what do you think, mr. mur y murphy? is this a judge likely to make fair decisions? >> oh, absolutely. i've known him since he was a baby prosecutor years ago and i followed his career all through