hearing about the losses they -- having -- after stand your ground, obviously you went to see sort of what you could see in terms of the process of how they do what they do. >> mm-hmm. >> but did you have any sort of preconceived ideas based on the fact that they've lost both corporate members as well as state legislators? >> i mean, there had been anecdotal information. i think until "the guardian" got ahold of these documents, i think everybody was is surprised at the extent to which they'd really been hurt by this. this organization is hurting. they have now abandoned the gun issues. they've abandoned some of the other issues that got in trouble. there's still a whole lot of controversy around it. of course, anything that's coke funded is going to raise certain eyebrows. they're even considering going into gambling to try to recruit gambling money to keep the organization afloat. when you're taking that gamble, then you know you're in a bit of trouble. >> i'm going to let you have that one. lee, one of the things that was
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