different men. the notion that you're going to make an argument to them that is a math-heavy, policy-dense argument, i think is ludicrous. i think it's about the candidates and their reasonableness. does the plan make sense? does it pass the smell test to people watching? in fact, are they able to paint a narrowtive that because of my policies, you at home watching this are going to be better off. and that's the space that the president needs to be in tonight, not into a math debate, not into a debate that you would see between aei and brookings, because i think he's the net loser on that. >> i think what the president tried to do in the last debate is say, what mitt romney is saying he will do will have this consequence for the deficit, which he says he doesn't want, so then he will have to do something that will hurt you at home. i can't even follow it without the numbers. >> if you go back and look at the debate, the president gave some pretty detailed answer s o the $5 trillion. >> he did that with numbers. >> here's some math that i think
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