c-span.org/impeachment. and listen on the go using the free c-span radio app. commanders from africa command and southern command testified before the senate armed services committee on their department's 2021 budget request and operations in their respective regions. they discussed russia and china's role in the regions, burden sharing with nato partners, combatting terrorism, and the cost of holding inmates at guantanamo bay. >> there we go. says it's time we start, so we're going to start. good morning. the committee today's received testimony from the command, southcom and africom. this is a very significant meeting because we have, in my narrow view, we have the two coms that never were adequately resourced. i really believe that. compared to the threat that we're facing. we have two great heroes here. we have general steve townsend, a commander at the u.s. africom and admiral greg fawler, commander of southcom. the committee is to ensure the national defense strategy. that's this. we have been adhering to this to the letter as near -- in a very bipartisan way. the -- we identified the competition with china and russia, to where the problem is, that some of the people were really sensitive to until we came out with this document. china and russia's growing influence isn't limited to europe, the indopacific, both countries view america and latin america as critical battlefields to fulfill their global ambit n ambitions and challenge the united states. this is particularly evident in africa. over the last 20 years i've conducted -- i think we're over about 160 african country visits working with that continent. i can tell you that it's no coincidence that china established the first overseas military base in jabuti. you know, that's the first time that they've done -- they've always done it in their own city limits before but now it's in jabuti. now they're as far south in africa as tanzania and all over the country. i visited jabuti last february and saw firsthand what they are doing there and they are active there. elsewhere, china's using the cash and debt to trap countries, force them to put their infrastructure and potentially their sovereignty on sale. at the same time, russia is using its military, mercenaries and weapons sales to buy influence, exploit africa's natural resources and to prop up leaders sympathetic to russian interests and hostile to the united states. while the nds is -- states that competition with russia and china should be dod's top priority, it makes clear that we must maintain pressure on radical terrorist groups like al qaeda and isis. today, more than a dozen terrorist groups with ties to al qaeda and isis are operating across africa. many of these groups have ambition to attack americans and our partners. without sustained pressure the threat posed by these groups will grow. in southcom's area of responsibility, china and russia are pursuing similar strategic strategy by using economic and military means to expand their access and influence right here on our own hemisphere. china has increased its naval deployments by the region by 70% over the last 5 years. in china, chinese companies kus currently have over 50 active port pronjects in this region ad more on the planning board. russia props up oppressive regimes in places like cuba, venezuela, nicaragua, that are os h how thil to t hostile to the united states. they're also deploying advanced military assets to the region including strategic bombers and warships and at the same time much of the drugs that are poisoning american cities are coming from latin america. these drugs are trafficked by illicit networks and i'd say in my opening statement that in both of these coms, i've been pretty outspoken as a conservative, one who's really been concerned because they don't seem to get the attention that some of the other coms do. mine, you know, if you look at africa, you have a total of 6,000 people there. how much are you going to get accomplished with 6,000 people? you look at sentcom, 75,000. actually, paycom's even bigger than that. if the object here, people are talking about it, is to reposition people. you're talking about the two areas where there aren't enough people to reposition. that's a narrow view, but that's mine. senator reed? >> well, thank you very much, mr. chairman, and i welcome our witnesses. first, let me extend my condolences to the families of the brave americans who were killed in action in the attack on the kenyan air base earlier this month. as well as those who are recovering from those wounds. and also extend my condolences to the families of the two airmen who were recently killed in afghanistan. again, thank you to the witnesses for appearing here today. both of you are leading commands during challenging times and we thank you for your continued service. please also extend our gratitude to the servicemen and women who under your command continue their outstanding service to the nation. there is currently an effort under way to review u.s. force posture around the globe to ensure that the department of defenses are allocated. we understand that africom is the first combat and command to go through the review process and that southcom will shortly follow. while it is wise, and in fact, necessary, to take a hard look b and methodical look at our investments and military activities around the globe, it would be streategically unwise o disengage from africa or latin america to generate small new term budget gains. given the small number of forces under consideration such a move would not generate the type of savings necessary for meaningful nds investments and would likely come at a much higher cost in terms of increased long-term security risk. our competitors recognize investing in africa ka and latin america is in their long-term interest, as evidenced by chinese and russian military and economic activity that continues to grow across these continents year by year. general townsend and admiral fawler, i look forward to hearing your assessments regarding how and where u.s. interests are best served in the southcom and africom areas of operations including where we may be able to gain efficiencies without undue risk to the u.s. interest and where you believe it will be strategically responsible to do so. as you note in your testimony, latin america and africa are beset by a vicious cycle of challenges competitors are seeking to leverage to their advantage. countries with weak democratic institutions and rampant corruption are being ruled by chinese and russian investments and covertly manipulated. reinformation operations and a flood of disinformation. we're not only competing globalgloba globally for influence and access, we must also work to ensu ensure new forms of mi-- i'm especially concerned about chinese economic intentions and when our partner countries are in position to defend themselves against china's predator lending practices. as you well know, the problems we face and the security solutions required are multidimensional. they do not lend themselves to geographical, bureaucratic boundaries, well resourced and whole of government solutions. continuing to restrict development aid, rebuff partners and allies and constrain multilateral efforts as the administration has repeatedly endeavored to do, all but ensures that present challenges in places like latin america and africa will continue to expand and travel to america's doorstep. i'll be interested in your views and the importance of investing in diplomacy and development to force long-term stability in these regions as well as your assessment of the impact of force reductions on the interagency and international partners we coordinate with and depend upon to advance our objectives. gentlemen, thank you for your service and thank you for your testimony. >> thank you, senator reed. we'll go ahead and start with opening statements. we'll start you,, general townsend. your entire statement will be made part of the record. you may proceed. >> chairman inhofe, ranking member reed and distinguished members of the committee, good morning and thank you for the opportunity to appear before you today. it's a privilege to be a part of and to lead america's finest men and women at u.s. africa command. an exceptional team dedicated to protecting america and advancing her interests on the african continent. i would like to take a moment to honor the memories of three exceptional americans, u.s. army specialist henry mayfield jr. mr. bruce triplett. and mr. dustin harrison who lost their lives in the service of our nation on january 5th in kenya. to their families, our thoughts and prayers are with you. your loved ones died while protecting the american people from the very real threat of al qaeda and al shabaab terrorist groups. i'm here this morning with my battle buddy, shipmate and friend, admiral craig fawler, to discuss shared challenges and opportunities in both our areas of responsibility while we further joint readiness of the joint force and our ability to fight across the globe. africom is critical to maintaining this ability as africa overwatches a global crossroads with strategic chokepoints and sea lines of communication that are essential to global commerce and critical to u.s. operations in the world. our future security, prosperity -- and prosperity rest on this strategic access. in times of crisis. and ensuring these waters remain free, open, and secure. u.s. africom is engaged in an ongoing blank slate review. in concert with the department of defense, we developed a prioritized list of objectives and actions to protect the homeland and secure our strategic interests in africa while ensuring the american taxpayers' investments are in the right areas. africa's key terrain for competition with china and russia who are aggressively using economic and military means to expand their access and influence. i believe africa offers america a competitive edge over china and russia and we should take advantage of it. we will grow more efficient to contribute to higher defense priorities and refocus resources to global power competition, but we cannot take pressure off major terrorist groups like al qaeda and isis. these groups and many others remain an inconvenient reality in africa. while we should not try to confront each one, we should remain resolute in confronting those who threaten americans and the american homeland. like al shabaab, the largest and most violent of al qaeda's branches. today africom does that with a light and relatively low-cost footprint by supporting african and international partners who are leading these efforts. in my first six months of command, i've learned that small investments, a few troops and a few bucks, can go a long way and make a real difference in africa. our whole of government and partner-centric approach acts as a force multiplier to address africa's many complex challenges. what africom accomplishes with a few people and a few dollars on a continent 3 1/2 times the size of the continental united states is a bargain for the american taxpayer and low-cost insurance for america in that region. a secure and stable africa remains an enduring american interest. u.s. africom stands ready to protect and advance american interests and respond to crises in africa. again, thank you, mr. chairman, and members of the committee for your continued support to our armed forces. i look forward to your questions. >> thank you, general townsend. admiral fawler. >> chairman inhofe, ranking member reed, senators, thank you for the opportunity to testify today. i'm honored to be here with my shipmate and good friend, general steve townsend. we also thank you for the stedfast support you provide to our men and women every day at southcom and it's -- i'm truly grateful for the honor and opportunity to lead them. i'm with ambassador gene mains, our civilian deputy commander, former u.s. ambassador to el salvador and sergeant major zickafoos, truly the eyes and ears of our command. the western hemisphere is our shared home, it's our neighborhood. we're connected to the nations there in every domain, sea, air, space, land, cyber, and most importantly culturally and with values. over the last year i've had the opportunity to visit our partners and see firsthand the opportunities and challenges that directly impact the security of our hemisphere. i've come to describe the challenges of vicious circle of threats that deliberately erodes the security and stability of this region and the united states of america. this vicious circle is framed by systemic issues of young democracies, with weak institutions, rampant corruption, exploited by transnational criminal organizations often better funded than the security organizations they face, external state actors that don't share those values, china, russia, iran, and violent extremist organizations. they're trying to advance their interests at the expense of u.s. and partner nation security. in fact, the ah-ha for me over the last year the extent to which china is aggressively pursuing its interests right here in our neighborhood. this vicious circle can be seen most acutely in the tragedy that's venezuela. the human suffering of this once thriving democracy has driven 5 million people to flee to neighboring countries like colombia, brazil, peru, ecuador, these countries are dealing with this and the stress to their health care, education, and social services are palatable. colombia alone spent $2.5 billion, significant part of their gdp over the last two years just to support the migrants. while russia, cuba and china prop up this illegitimate maduro dictatorship, the democracies of the world look for a way to get the venezuelan people what they deserve, a free and prosperous venezuela. the only way to attack this vicious circle is as a team, and this neighborhood a little goes a long way and our partners are willing to contribute, but we need the right and focused persistent military presence, which might take the form of brigades or small teams of special operation forces or marines to conduct specialized training, national guard forces forming relations via the state partnership forces, maritime forces where presence at sea establishes sea control and attacks these transnational criminal organizations. as we've recently done with the deployment of the combat ship "uss detroit." deployments show the best outstretched hand of america, and that mission treated over 70,000 patients and extended our enduring promise as a trusted partner to the neighborhood. security cooperation is a critical tool in a region with willing partners who thrive givens the opportunity. international military education and training is a small investment that yields long-term returns. it builds lasting, trusted relationships. as i speak, half of our nation's chiefs of defense are graduates of imat programs. finally our people are our greatest assets. in key west, our southern most base in the continental united states holds significant strategic value in defending against a wide range of threats to national security, u.s. national security. we're taking steps to improve the resiliencies of that headquarters building, and to improve the quality of life of our military and civilian personnel who struggle in one of the country's most expensive economies. in miami we're also working to address the cost of living and housing concerns that create hardships for our families. mr. chairman, ranking member reed, thank you again for the opportunity to testify today. southcom team appreciates the support of congress and you continue to place trust and honor in us, and we won't let you down. i look forward to your questions. >> thank you, admiral faller. the comments made in opening statement, i'm very sincere about, because a lot of people don't realize when they look at all of the coms around, did we ever have the right resources relative to the threat that are posed and i'm going to ask you each the same question, which i've worded very carefully because we hear from so many people who are not aware of the threat to our national security that you would find in southcom and in africa. why does it really matter? terms of our national security, and i'm going to start with you admiral faller. you've touched on it. i know you believe in it. the question would be, why should the american people care what china and russia are doing in africa and latin america? specifically, how does what they are doing threaten our national security? i know the president is very interested in this. he wants to make sure that we're not -- we don't have resources in places that don't have a direct threat on our national security. i would like to have you restate what the direct threat is out there to our national security. >> senator, this region matters. it's the cultural values, it's the extensive interaction we have in trade. we have a positive trade balance with the region, but that's eroding. we are the number one trading partner. china's fast catching that -- catching us in that regard. panama canal strategic access, two-thirds of the traffic that goes through that has an economic direct tie to the united states. i look around the region and i see china working on multiple port deals, i.t. infrastructure, dams, mining, logging, fishing, including a significant illegal fishing and illegal mining and illegal logging. i look at the port accesses that they're pursuing in el salvador and jamaica and bahamas and ask why would china want to buy an island and lock up a 99 year lease for most of the coast of el salvador within a two hour flight of the continent united states. they're trying to achieve positional advantage in our neighborhood and that's alarming and concerning to me and drives the urgency with which i look at this competition. >> yeah. you know, the terrorists throughout, we're not really talking about just the locally there in el salvador and the rest. you are the door to this country, right through your area, and i think you've stated that very well. the same thing to you, general townsend, we have i think may not have mentioned this in the opening statement, but if you're looking for places to save, i can't see that you would find it there. i mean you have a total of 6,000, 6,500 people on the continent, 4,000 are in djibouti and that's -- of course they have other missions outside of the continent of africa, but it gets you -- when you go to west africa, 1,200, 1,300 people, now -- and so it's not like the others with 75,000, 80,000 people. so specifically, in africa, talking about how that directly affects our national security. >> thank you, chairman. so you ask why should america care for africa? for a lot of the same reasons that admiral faller talked about. america caring about south america although it's more geographically different. the strategic access that america needs to the african continent rest on the fact that it's that global crossroads i talked about in my opening statement. there's also tremendous natural resources there to include rare earth minerals that america needs. there's also a burgeoning population there and there's good and bad news with that. it's a potential tremendous opportunity for the future, also a significant risk. i think that in the past, maybe we've been able to pay less attention to africa and it be okay for america. i don't believe that's the case for the future. as far as the threats, china and russia are every bit as busy in africa today, for the same reasons that admiral faller talked about them being busy in south america. they are acting on their own behalf for positional advantage and russia in particular seeking extractive -- pursuing extractive ventures. china and russia are seeking to counter the strategic access that we need for american security and american prosperity. secondly, the violent extremist organizations that are on the continent, both in the east and in the west, some of those groups threaten the american homeland today. some of them will potentially be a threat in the future years. >> yeah. i appreciate that. i'm glad you mentioned in your opening statement the imet program because, you know, china realizes what we've done with that program, how well that has served us, and so they're now emulating that. they actually had a meeting in beijing with -- i think they had all 52 countries represented there, talking about how they were going to expand that program, put more money in it and that you're watching that, i'm sure, very carefully throughout your whole area? >> yes, chairman. >> okay. good. senator reed? >> thank you very much, mr. chairman. thank you, again, general townsend and admiral faller. i think you safely said that both of yours are conducting forced operations, is that right, general townsend? >> that is what we're doing. >> admiral faller? >> we're at a low level of force. >> right. and we have to do that, but we have to do it smartly and wisely. that means cooperation and collaboration across our government and also collaboration with other governments. general townsend, the french are now conducting significant operations in the part of africa. if we drew down, what signal would that send and what practical consequences might that have for their cooperation in the fight? >> senator reed, so as you pointed out, the french are the lead international partner in the region of west africa. they have about 4,500 troops there that are engaged in active operations every day to counter the threat that's there. the threat that comes from both al qaeda groups and isis groups there. that threat is very serious and that threat is on the advance and i think the french would say, in fact they have said publicly, recently, that their efforts are not having the desired effect they need. we are supporting both the french and the larger international effort there. there's a significant european effort there. our position, the position of the department of defense is that the europeans need to step up and do more in the sahel. the french are calling on europe to step up and do more. i think that is the right thing to do. as we see the violent extremists advancing, if we were to withdraw support from the french precipitously, then that would not go in a good direction. so i think what we have to do, we have to synchronize our support and the removal of support, if we decide to do that, with the arrival of european support. there is a chance there that french can offset that. >> what you're saying it wouldn't be particularly coherent if we're telling the eu to step up support as we reduce our support? >> i think there's certainly a timing issue there, senator, absolutely. >> admiral faller, following up on the point that chairman made, which i think is an excellent point, programs like imet are absolutely critical and in your area, china is aggressively pursuing these imet options. you indicated in certain countries, el salvador there's one imet slot that u.s. offers and 50 that chinese offer? >> recently an example was provided along those lines where they've come in and analyzed how many folks we were sending to carlisle, and they were going five times over that to their war college in china, which they've copied from our program and translated it into spanish and we've talked to the students that come back from that to get a sense of the quality and approach. it's based off of the u.s. doctrine. >> it has to be pointed out that the imet program is funded by the department of state. one of the critical programs we're talking about is not within d.o.d., which again suggests that this whole of government approach we have to look not just at funding for your co-com, but are we putting money into the state department, aid, various programs that will allow you to conduct a much more efficient economy of force operation? is that fair? >> that's an accurate statement. we depend on that imet, senator. >> going back to africa, general townsend, you indicated that the extremist threat is all through the continent but my sense is al shabaab and others are still contemplating sort of projecting power outside of africa which is a much more critical threat to the united states, is that fair? >> senator, that's accurate. >> and so we're going to continue to focus on that threat to the united states in particular? >> i believe we should. >> the -- finally, i think, again, the issue here is maintaining appropriate force and also maintaining the coordination within our government and with our allies and i would -- you're pursuing that and i think you should continue to do so. >> senator rounds. >> thank you, mr. chairman. gentlemen, thank you for your service to our country. i would like to begin by just talking a little bit about the disinformation and influence operations which russia has used successfully in a number of instances. specifically what plans and actions that you have and your team have created to address the technological advances and changing character of war to ensure america maintains a strategic advantage in your areas of operation. >> the disinformation campaign that russia has been on is truly about, in all instances, painting the united states in an inaccurate light and in one example is reporting that i was on the border of venezuela about to lead an invasion force. another example was, they twisted it just enough in an article in r.t. to say that i had said something that was at odds with the vice president of the united states which was complete bologna. their largest by volume outside of the russian language effort in social media is in spanish. you have to ask what's the national interest of russia in that disinformation here in our neighborhood and around the world, and it's concerning to us. we've countered within our means within operations, military information and support, strong partnership with state department and linemen in messaging information with some increased authorities to go after them and put the truth out and try to make a dent in that space, but more needs to be done, clearly, and more should be done to take advantage of machine learning, those types of skills, that the department has embarked on to really get after and thwart their disinformation campaigns. >> general townsend. >> senator, not unlike southcom, you know, we see the same kind of disinformation campaigns and not just from russia, but from other actors such as iran. recently iran announced that i was killed at the engagement at mandabay. i'm glad to hear that's exaggerated. there's fairly low-tech warfare in africa overall, but we do see armed uavs, unmanned vehicles, armed now being provided by multiple actors -- china, turkey, et cetera. we also see sophisticated air defense systems. they're offering to equip african cities with a camera system, surveillance system, facial recognition technologies, 00 and, of course, we know that all of those systems are reporting back to china first before they report to the african country where they're established. i think that the growth of high-tech is a concern certainly in africa. >> thank you. i think part of the challenge we have is sharing that -- look, the propaganda has never really quit from our adversaries. they understand its value and they're very good at it. they simply advanced to using social media and other means in which to really bend things their direction. in doing so, they influence individuals who really in many cases share the same values that we share in this country. the imet program has been mentioned several times here and i think it's critical that we continue to be able to have communications and relationships with what is in many cases perhaps one of the most stable forms or one of the most stable parts of any one of these nation's governments and that is their military. while their civilian leaders come and go, in many cases they have a stable force of professionals and the question is, do they find and do they understand the way that we do business to be appropriate and a better way than what our adversaries offer them? i would like to once again offer each of you the opportunity to talk a little bit about imet, at this time in which some people question whether or not it is a valid program, and how critical it is and how inexpensive it is for us to continue to have that relationship with the militaries from the different countries. >> the value is in the building of trust. you get to know your shipmate, your battle buddy, share experience and doctrine. recent example in el salvador, the new president came in, favorable connections to the united states, appointed a new chief of defense and minister of defense, minister of defense is a naval war college grad, chief of defense is an army war college grad. you can sit down around a roundtable and have a serious conversation without stilted talking points about the real challenges and opportunities and the complexity of making progress. that's just one of many examples i could cite, senator. >> thank you. >> senator, just like admiral faller has explained, imet is invaluable to us. i think it's a long-term way to influence a government and a military by training those people who grow up to be the chief of defense and the same kind of thing is found in africa as well. i think they seek out the united states as a preferred partner for a number of reasons. not the least of which is our competence and capability, but also our values. that's part of that. i think that's a strong thing that is imparted through imet. >> thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. general townsend, admiral faller, let me begin by adding my condolences to those that have been expressed already for the service members lost in the month of january. i want to particularly call out captain ryan fanu, from hudson new hampshire, an airman lost in afghanistan this week. i know that all of new hampshire mourns his loss and the loss of everyone and sends condolences to all of the families. so thank you. i want to begin, admiral faller, with where we are with drug interdiction. when you were here last year, we talked about the drug interdiction efforts, which are still so important to states like new hampshire where we have a huge opioid epidemic still, and are seeing heroin now coming into the country. can you talk about what progress has been made and the role that "uss detroit" has played in improving interdiction efforts? >> senator, as we have discussed, the deaths due to the narcotics overdoses, drugs, it's too many and it's a national security challenge. those pathways that they come through just as easily are used by terrorists and other illicit materials and we can't do enough to get after that challenge in our neighborhood and how it erodes communities across the country. over the past year, we've focused on building our partners to get them more into the game. 50% of our interdictions last year were partner enabled and nations like colombia have stepped up to lead their own exercises and operations recently, an o'ryan operation, where we had many metric tons. 18 nations participated, colombian led, all we did with the u.s. is participate. that's a key effort and we have to do more there. in our own efforts intelligence sharing is key. human intelligence and intelligence, surveillance reconnaissance from platforms, we need more intelligence surveillance and reconnaissance. our human efforts were funded, but they were funded above our core budget in an unfunded requirement. the key area to look at, how do we get more efficient but also apply leverage there. finally, in our platforms we depend on ships at the end of the day, it's got to be a coast guard cutter and our coast guard performed brilliantly supplying more ships than they promised through the allocation process and our navy stepped up with the "uss detroit." we need more ships. we think the number would be about three to sustain the presence and pressure. the pressure matters on these nations and that pressure has to be at the source in eradication and at the street here in the u.s. colombia has made progress at that source. i eradicated cocaine with the colombian chief of defense on the ecuador border. they've made progress. the result has been that the deaths are down, but still too many. we had almost a record year in interdictions, but still not enough. >> thank you for those efforts and we hope that we can continue to do more to support them. this question is for both of you. we've now for the last two and a half years had the women peace and security act in effect. d.o.d. has made significant progress in implementing that. we put $4 million for gender advisors into the 2020 defense budget. can you talk about the successes that you've seen both in southcom and africom because of the effort to better integrate women and be able to appeal to those women in africa and latin america who we need to address if we're going to be successful? >> thanks, senator. so you asked me about women in peace and security at my confirmation hearing six months ago and i told you i didn't know much about it and i would look too it. i was able to attend one of these forums. at africom, women and peace and security is integrated into every event that we do. we see some advantages here. it's not just about promoting the role of women in the armed forces but it has an impact across their society as well. it's integral to everything we do and we've had a communications symposium which i was fortunate enough to attend. we have female intel officer training program and there's a seminar that's about to kickoff and a flint lock exercise we're about to start. those are some examples. we try to integrate some of that into every event. >> good. thank you. >> similarly, we integrated in every event, senator. recently ambassador means and i were in colombia. we did a roundtable with some key women warriors from the colombian army. the chief of defense, the chief of the army and air force. in that audience of women, it's about 50 of them, were nine sergeant majors, command sergeant majors, and i'll tell you what, they were getting after it. it was motivating. afterwards the chief of the colombian army said hey, can you do some more of that with us because it really brings out the competitive spirit, the reason why we're better when we're integrated and stronger when we're integrated. >> well, thank you both very much. i think it's a very important model for us to show to the rest of the world, particularly in developing countries and africa and latin america. >> thank you, mr. chair. i would second that. thank you, senator shaheen, for those words. gentlemen, thank you very much for being here today. we truly appreciate your efforts in some challenging regions that often aren't hitting the headlines of our newspapers every day. thanks to you, thanks for your team. sergeant major, good luck to you on retirement as it's upcoming. i still think nebraska or iowa is a great place to go. admiral faller, thank you for sitting down with me the other day. i really do appreciate that. we had a great discussion and i would like to go a little more into imet. you've heard my colleagues talking about how important it is. we had an emerging threats and capabilities subcommittee hearing just a while back and you were able to visit with us about the importance of imet at that particular subcommittee meeting. it has been in the press a lot lately. we all acknowledge that we can do better in vetting. but strategically can you talk to what that means for our partners strategically and what it does to assist not only those countries but the united states as well? >> the united states military education system is our strength and like the education system in our country, our training education is sought-after and valued and builds stronger partners that know and trust us and the relationships that go with that last a lifetime. it just -- an example of that comes up time and time again. i have a deputy -- i have a director, a colombian brigadier general, a full director of our exercise division, a graduate of levenworth, carlisle, the pathfinder school, advanced armor school and the rangers school, an honor grad of ranger school, and the colombians value that, as do our partner nations, and so we can use more imet. our budget is about $10 million a year for 28 democratic countries. secretary of defense esper visited southcom last week. a priority of his is to seek more money. he's seeking a 50% increase in the imet budget. we could spent that 50% increase next year and our schoolhouses in the western hemisphere institute for security at ft. benning, game changer, american air force academy in texas. these are schoolhouses we don't think a lot about, in addition to carlisle, newport, maxwell, with the air force and the marine corps university, but these -- all these schoolhouses work together to make a difference in strengthening the hemispheric security. >> general townsend. >> senator, i couldn't say it any better than admiral faller just did. >> thank you. now, i do appreciate that. our state partnership programs as well, iowa is partnered with kosovo and i know a number of those officers that i worked with a decade ago. i've seen them rise through the ranks and we continue to stay in close contact. but those partnerships are very, very valuable. so thank you. admiral faller, i want to talk a little bit about the integration of missions we see between southcom and northcom. obviously there's been a lot of attention on our southern border and what has continued to happen with drug cartels, whether it is weapons crossing the border, whether it's the drugs that senator shaheen just talked about. all of that is very concerning. but what i would like to focus on in just a minute and a half i have left is also the issue of human trafficking. not only do we have illegal drug trade, wreaking havoc across iowa, a lot of our rural communities, but iowa wrestles a lot with the serious problem of human trafficking and the polaris project in 2016 dubbed des moines, iowa as one of the top 100 human trafficking sites in the united states. that's not something we are proud of. so could you describe the resourcing and coordination challenges that exist when you're trying to address the threat between these different areas of responsibility between southcom and northcom? >> southcom and northcom work very closely together. general o'shaughnessy and i traveled to mexico, mexico city. we sat down with the head of their army and navy to talk about how do we improve information sharing, how do we get after these ungoverned spaces that are spawning instability into north america and beyond and south america and latin america and the caribbean and how do we help the mexicans share information with guatemala. a very productive meeting that we came up with tangible steps to do that. we went to guatemala city the next day and had that same level of conversation with those nations to try to forge more coordination. at the heart of getting after these wicked problems that create an instability here, including the human traffic, is sharing intelligence, building trust, breaking down barriers, understanding and then ensure that the right agency, law enforcement agency, other agencies, have the information they need to make an impact and that's a key element of what we're doing as we move ahead. we take that into exercise program, which is also a similar element. we are adequately resourced to do this, but we are carefully looking at how we can become more efficient as we move forward. >> very good. please let us know if there's anything additional that we as congress can help with. gentlemen, thank you very, very much for your service to our country. thank you. >> thank you, mr. chair. thank you to our witnesses. i want to add my comments of support for the families of colonel vos and captain fanuf. colonel vos was based out of joint base langley in virginia and thinking about his family and all those that you mentioned. admiral faller, i want to start with you in venezuela. an article in the "wall street journal" a couple days ago i'd like to put into the record, and the title is unnecessary provocative, how putin out foxed trump in venezuela. i don't think the title is a fair characterization. i think the article, though, is very, very good. basically, if i were going to title the article i would title it "how the u.s. underestimated the difficulty of what we were trying to do in venezuela." i think the u.s. has done a number of good things and the trump administration has. i could pick a few faults, but generally done good. the core of the article is how we really underestimated how hard it would be, and i just remember this last year when we were talking about it here and in the foreign relations committee, there were sort of some real blue sky scenarios that were being painted by the administration about how, you know, maduro is about to collapse, and i went to colombia and visited in colombia and then went to the border in march and everything i was hearing from the colombians and everybody down there, this isn't easy and it's going to be hard. they were exactly right about how difficult it was going to be, and here on capitol hill we were getting blue sky scenarios from the administration about the imminent collapse of the maduro government and we just got it wrong on the intel side. we just got it wrong. and i -- and one of the things that's galling in the article is, one of the reasons it's so hard is not just our adversaries, venezuela is propped up by iran and cuba and china and russia, but uae, turkey, india, allies of ours have helped them evade u.s. sanctions and prop them up and they're one of the reasons why the maduro government has had some lasting power. so i guess i just really want to caution all of us on matters like this, these are tough situations and we can do everything right and still find it very hard to accomplish what we want. that's not our fault, but we need to be very weary of blue sky scenarios and told we'll support this person and things are likely to work out our way. we're in for the long haul in these situations and i'll tell you, admiral faller, i would love to talk to you further, we've done european reassurance initiatives and asian reassurance initiatives, might be time to do an america reassurance initiative. i don't really like the title, reassurance sounds defensive, like no, we're really interested in you. i don't know that we have to be defensive about it, but we need to have a comprehensive whole of government, diplomacy, and military, and economic trade focus on the americas because while we're focusing elsewhere i know where our adversaries are focused, they're focusing in our backyard. general townsend, i want to ask you a question, there was a recent study of some challenges within the special operations community and while it was special operations focused, a number of the areas of the study dealt with items looking at a variety of cultural and ethical challenges in a special operations forces and -- including some that led to scandals and many took place in africom. one of the themes was extremely high operational tempos caused problems, and here was the finding, quote, a trend of disaggregation at the individual and small team levels risks employing forces where operational requirements misaligned with the 4 gen validation standards. i've been on the committee seven years. i think what that means, we had forces deployed in teams and sizes that lacked the oversight or the ability to do the missions they were assigned. now i think the recommendations are largely for southcom, but because southcom operates within combatant commands what responsibility do you think that they have in making sure the forces provided to you are appropriately resourced and led? >> thanks, senator. i am familiar with the study and i'm familiar with the conclusions of it and i agree with what that study talks about. as you're aware, most of the forces operating on the african continent these days are special operating forces not exclusively, but a lot of them. this phenomenon you mentioned correctly does not just apply to special operating forces. over the course of this war, we have disaggregated formations time and time again and separated small teams from their higher echelons of command and leadership. >> some of the recommendations are or findings are a little like the study about the mccain and fitzgerald instances in the pacific. there are similar challenges about high ops tempo and other things leading to problems. right. so i think at the co-com level we need to do whatever he need to do to keep teams together. i've been a commander that's had my team disaggregated and scattered all over so i'm a believer in keeping team integrity in every task that we can. also, actually part of our blank slate review process that we're undergoing with the department of defense is to look at how we can reduce the operational tempo, particularly of soft forces but all forces, reduce the operational tempo so it's not just about trying to redirect resources but it's to return some resources to home stations so that they're -- the soft operational tempo is still stretched even though it's now reaching about one year deployed for two years at home. the goal is one to three and there's still work to be done. >> thank you very much. thanks, mr. chair. >> thank you, mr. chairman. general townsend, i represent arizona and on january 5th, dustin harrison from houston was killed by al shabaab terrorists in kenya. his wife, hope, and his 2-year-old daughter heaven are back home in tucson grieving the loss of her husband and father. now, a i was a part of the team in my last assignment in the military. one of the more challenging assignments i had. so i'm aware of the challenges you have on the continent, but some articles about the situation there was that it was a woefully undefended perimeter or surprisingly sparse security given the level of assets, air assets and others that you have there. i know an investigation is ongoing and i don't want to put anymore of our service men and women into harm's way but what can you share about what's happening today to make sure an attack like that is not happening or the risk is not going to happen now and in the future, and what can i share with heaven and hope to make sure that others are not going to be in a similar risk? >> thanks, senator. as i mentioned in my opening statement, i also offer our condolences. those family members are in our thoughts and prayers. thank you for pointing out there's an investigation going on so i don't want to get in front of that. you've worn a uniform so you know that frequently what we think we know at the start of an event is not what we know after we've investigated it. but there are some early conclusions. i think it's self-obvious we were not as prepared there as we needed to be. al shabaab managed to penetrate onto that airfield. a lot of people don't know but the base where our troops live is not where the airfield is. but they were able to get access to that airfield, kill three americans, and destroy six aircraft there. so we weren't as prepared and we're digging into that to find out why that's the case. but, since that event we have -- there's about 120 infantrymen there on the ground now who are securing that place and they've been working hard since 6 january to put in the appropriate level of defenses. so i'm confident that by the time they're done, manda bay will be much more properly defended. we're not just stopping there though. we're looking across the continent because i think that we viewed and the kenyans viewed manda bay as a safe area. the kenyans have family housing there. it's a resort area. al shabaab has shown their reach and the danger that they pose and i think we need to take that seriously. so i'm looking with a clear eye at every location in africa now. >> great, thank you. i was a j-33 in that assignment running our counter-terrorism operations. one of the challenges we had at the time -- this was back in 2007 to 2010 -- we saw al shabaab sgroegrowing. we saw the training camps. we were watching hundreds of thousands of people being trained. the obama administration felt like they weren't a real problem or risk so we couldn't take them out. last year i think there were 67 strikes conducted in somalia. can you share what the impact of those strikes are, and is it whack-a-mole or what is the strategy going forward in order to address this growing terrorist threat in east africa? >> so there's an international effort there that supports the somali government. >> we've been talking about that for a very long time. >> the somali national army, so our role is in support of that. so the two major tasks that we're doing is helping to train part -- a specific part of the somali national army, the special ed infantry units, and we're also doing counter-terrorism strikes. they're meant to help the international effort and the somali effort but they're also meant to protect america. i don't believe that it's whack-a-mole. what we do is we keep an eye on al shabaab every day, and we're looking for ways to reduce their capacity wherever we can. so that effort to disrupt and degrade al shabaab and their leadership and their mid-level leadership and higher-level leadership is a critical part of what we're doing. >> thanks. i'm out of time but i'll submit questions for the record specifically about the drug flow coming from aor to the country through my state, arizona, and the latest tactics that the cartels are using and how we're countering them but i'll have to submit those for the record. thanks. thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i want to talk in a few minutes about china and russia and their activities both in latin america and in africa, but admiral faller, since we've been here, eight americans have died of drug overdoses in the last hour. 67,000 people a year, one person a day in maine. what's going on with china and russia are threats, they're indirect threats, they're important, but we're talking about americans dying. you and i have talked about this in the past. i've heard from you and from other national security officials that we are picking up -- we are interdikting about 25% of the drug shipments through the ocean to north america that we know of, 25% of what we know of. to me, we're talking about allocating resources around the world for all kinds of threats. this is a direct threat killing americans and we don't have enough ships. i don't get it. when do we get to interdikting the ships that we know are carrying drugs into this country to kill our people? >> it's a national security crisis. >> absolutely. >> it's actually worse statistics than you mentioned. we detect 25%. we're only interdikting 9%. to interdikt, we need greater partner capacity as i mentioned in answer to senator sheehan. we also need assets. at the end of the day you've got to be on the field to compete. >> who do i need to talk to to get those assets, the secretary of defense, the president, the vice president? where do we go? it's infuriating that we know what's coming, we know what's out there, and the phrase i got was, we have far more targets than we can action. that's a euphemism for we are woefully falling down on this responsibility. >> the coast guard stepped up in a big way. our u.s. navy continues to have readiness challenges that has them stretched globally that has impacted their force allocation to us. >> is it people or ships? do we just need more ships, more -- >> it's not just ships, senator. we need the intelligence, the reconnaissance. we have about 20% of what our need is there. then that then turns into the ability to interdikt. we also need steady funding and security corporations so we can help our partner nations help themselves. it's pulling this together in a full court press beyond ships that we can work together with partners and get the "w" in front of whole of government, senator. >> i appreciate that and i know you're working on this but i just hope you'll keep pressing. if you have to say there's a really obnoxious senator that's on my back and i've got to do something, that's fine. i can fulfill that responsibility quite adequately. let's talk about china for a minute. by the way, these charts to both of you are very helpful. it really graphicicly indicates what's going on. it seems to me china is following sort of a two-track strategy in both africa and south america. one is what i call debt imperialism. they're getting these small countries in debt to them and then they've got their hooks into them. general, is that part of what you're seeing happening in africa? >> that is exactly what we're seeing. we're also seeing a new, more sophisticated development in that. so the debt trap diplomacy has now become known on the continent. most african leaders are wise to it. actually, i would commend our state department for helping get african leaders more savvy about what the chinese are doing with some of these debt trap loans. the chinese are adapting though and evolving their presentation and they're becoming more sophisticated about it. so i'm a little bit worried because they're getting smarter about it. >> well, that's a concern but the other thing is sort of more direct. i think admiral faller, you used the word positional advantage. just looking at your chart, jamaica, el salvador, ecuador, chile, belize, ports, ports, i mean, that's a strategic advantage. whatever happened to the monroe doctrine? we're allowing an adversary, i won't say an enemy but an adversary, to establish significant positional advantage within our hemisphere. admiral? >> senator, it's not just the ports. it's space stations, cyber, safe cities. china has figured out that the nations in latin america and the caribbean are cash strapped so instead of trying to do arms sales they're coming in with significant gifts. i could cite 17 million in one country in south america, 20 million in a caribbean nation. these are one-year gifts of trucks and boats and i.t. infrastructure well beyond uniforms and pme. that is alarming to me as they build not just debt but dependency and we're trying to build trust in teams. >> maybe our motto should be beware of chinese bearing gifts and telecommunications equipment. thank you, gentlemen, i appreciate your testimony. >> thank you, mr. chairman. and thanks to both of you for your service and for being here today. i want -- i'm going to ask each of you to elaborate on the topic that admiral faller just brought up in response to senator king's first question. each of you and/or your predecessors have commented of the challenge given the mass geography that you're responsible for, each of you, the challenges in isr, admiral that you just raised. are you getting the assets that you've asked for, the assets you need? if not, why not, if you know? and then, to put even a finer point perhaps or an additional point on that broader discussion that i want you to have with me, on december 20th with the signing of the ndaa, of course we began the process of standing up the sixth military -- the military branch in space force. and space force seems to me to fit right into this and what i'm wondering about, i know it's early but time is short, have you been invited into the discussion or inserted yourself into the discussion of how did that best man train, equip a space force to assist you, and then maybe you can elaborate a little bit on your partner countries and what role, if any, they could play. i'd ask each of you, admiral, to go first and then general townsend. >> intelligence around reconnaissance, a key part of our intelligence picture is a global demand and we're short in this hemisphere. i mentioned we are meeting 20% of our goal. a good chunk of that 20% is using the department of homeland security, customs protection and border cbp assets, so it's a team effort. the dod portion is probably closer to about 8%, so it's key. we recognize the global challenges and we do the best we can with what we have. i think there's some advances in machine learning and artificial intelligence that we can use and should pursue, and we're going to work that. with respect to space force, we have excellent coordination with general raymond and his team. it's a key interest like cyber in every nation that we deal with. fundamental to this is information sharing into the space realm and space agreements that we're working with nations like brazil, chile and other countries that will help counter china's efforts in that realm and continue to ensure that we have positional advantage. we can't work fast enough in that arena, senator, but we're working as hard as we can. >> senator, on your question about resources, i would say that my command is with one exception is pretty adequately resourced for what we're -- the task we're given to do today. as small as those resources are, i think it's adequate with the exception of isr that you mentioned. every commander that sits in front of you will say the exact same thing. admiral faller briefed his resourcing about 25% of our known validated requirement for isr. you mentioned the space force so interestingly enough i just met with general raymond yesterday. we were discussing about the development of his new force and we're in constant contact with the space force and space command. they've recently deployed some folks to our headquarters to assist us with space. everything we do of course on the continent has ties to space, and not only on our side but on our adversaries' side as well. i recently got a briefing the chinese have somewhere between 13 and 16 pieces, facilities, space facilities on the african continent and the russians have five or six. so they're also very investing heavily in space infrastructure on the african continent. >> thank you both. with that i yield my time. >> thank you, mr. chairman. gentlemen, thank you for your ongoing service as well. you both highlighted in your written testimony the national guard state partnership program and how that works to ensure bonds both at junior level and senior levels with militaries in your region. in the last four years, the michigan national guard has completed 19 events with liberia, one of their state partnership counterparts, and they've also planned another 20 events coming up in this next fiscal year. i had the opportunity to see some of that firsthand in 2017 when i was in liberia. i know that the partnership certainly helps build relationships in west africa as well as other places around the world. my question to both of you is how are you leveraging state partnership programs in your area of responsibility and when i look at the amount of money we're spending, roughly $3 million in each of your areas, maybe give us a sense of what you're doing, is that adequate resourcing, and if not, what would be adequate and what would you do with it? general townsend? >> thanks, senator. the state partnership program is a fantastic resource for us. i didn't have a good appreciation for it until i took this job, and one of the first conferences i went to, all of the 14 at the time, 14 partnerships were present with their national guard partners from the united states. it's very responsive. it's very flexible. what i like about it is the states and the countries do a lot of things sort of below the radar constantly. it's a constant kind of presence. we now have 15 partnerships in africa. we've just added rwanda and nebraska. that's the new one, and the next one in the cue we're working up towards ethiopia. these countries want these partnerships. they talk to their counterparts in the content thmponent and ree value of them. i can't say enough about them. >> are they resourced enough? >> i think they're probably adequate right now. what i haven't done is i haven't done an analysis to see if we add ethiopia do we get more money or is that another mouth to feed from the same $2.9 million. i got to look into that. i don't know the answer to that. i'll get back to you on that. >> great, thank you. admiral faller? >> extremely similar experience, a relationship that aligns itself and year after year builds friendships, the training that's provided, the equipment. most of our exercise support for our major exercise comes from state partnerships, and that's something that we depend on as our force provider. so it's a game changer for us. we added brazil and new york this year and it was a big deal for the brazilians and the new york national guard. in terms of the funding levels, we're seeking to see -- to get a guard partner rep established in every embassy as part of our embassy teams. we're working through the funding with respect to that and we think there's an opportunity for some additional state partners within our headquarters to augment our force and to increase the understanding of how we can leverage partner expertise. cyber is a particular area where some states are excellent in cyber and how do we better leverage that. i would have to get back to you on that level of funding so i'll take that for the record. but the authority's piece is also an area too so we can use the flexible authorities. one quick story. recently in colombia, we have oklahoma, the state -- it's not a state partner of colombia but the oklahoma guard has surged isr support for six months, and to help augment colombia in getting after dissidents and narcotic traffic. some tremendous success with just 30 guardsmen and one contractor support. low cost, high payoff. >> thank you. i have a very limited time so i'll try to be just a quick answer from each of you. we understand the climate change will have a significant impact on security issues across the planet. the army work college recently put out a report suggesting the challenges of climate change. in the brief time we have left, is there one specific concern related to climate change in your area that you think we should be focusing on? general, you want to start? >> yes. i think probably the desert any occasion that we see expanding south from the sahara, and water management i think. water is going to be a huge point of friction on the african continent in the future. >> recently in central america we look at the impact on changes in weather to the coffee and the white corn and things like that so we're really focused on how we work with whole government to support the stability necessary so people can stay home and find jobs. >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you, gentlemen, for being here. i was struck by some of your comments. i think even senator king's comments led me to kind of aggrega aggregate. you accomplished so much with few people and few dollars. admiral faller, you said we do the best we can with what we have. i've heard adequate used several times and probably adequate used one time. so when we have this discussion about why aren't you doing more, i always wonder whether or not you all should just put a mirror down there and say because you're not giving us the resources to say more than adequate, thinking strategically, doing more, anticipating threats. so a large extent the graphics were great, but what we're trying to do is catch up with a pace in china and against china and in africa and south america where it looks like we're los g losing -- the gap is narrowing and in some points we're trying to catch up. is that an adequate statement? >> we see our competitive advantage narrowing in this hemisphere and we've got to maintain that competitive advantage across all the elements of national power and folks in the military, so what does it take to do that. certainly more efficient use of the resources we have, leveraging other things. i mentioned artificial intelligence a couple times, but at the end of the day, any athletic competition i've ever been in or anything i've ever done takes a person to compete. so zero in any math equation is either zero or unsolvable. so we got to be present to make a difference. >> general townsend? >> senator, i think that our competitive advantage is not eroding in some cases. they have an advantage. so there are some areas we're just not going to outcompete china in and one example is spending money in large amounts on the african continent to build infrastructure. we're not going to build bridges and dams and railroads and stadiums and palaces like they're doing. we have to rely on our strengths and i think our interagency and military have a lot of also don have to compete everywhere in africa. we have to pick and choose where we're going to outcompete. >> if i have time, i'm going to ask a little bit about that. but we all have to take a look at what's happening around the globe. when all of a sudden, we see the threat of iran in the middle aek east, we have to redeploy assets there, it's got to come from somewhere. i've had several discussions with your predecessors, admiral, and they say the thing that's most frustrating to them is they have enough intelligence to know there is a lot of stuff moving across the border. killing american citizens. there's just not a damn thing they can do about it. you just don't have the resources on the water or on the ground to do it. and i really do believe if you take a look at the number of people who are dying from narco terrorism, it's remarkable to me. the hundreds of people who die every day in this country. if that was a terrorist organization doing that anywhere in the world, we would stand up a capability and reign down hell on them. but it's happening every single day. i want to ask you a question because i'll run out of time. as you're looking north of your area of responsibility and into the southern border of mexico, how much better are we getting at securing that border so you're limiting the pathways that these drugs, guns, and -- and victims of human trafficking? how are -- are we starting to tighten and make any progress there on -- within your area of responsibility? and any comments you can give on mexico's contribution would be appreciated. >> we certainly look at the security as a required zone defense. so border security is almost like a goal line stand. you need your linebackers and halfbacks as you move down. so i think the pressure has worked. we have seen some positive indication. but clearly, given the migrants that have recently -- migrant caravans that have recently come up. the connection between those caravans and trans-national organizations and narco trafficking, clearly more needs to be done. and it's got to be those nations stepping up. the partners have to step up. and our whole of government efforts sustained in a way to get after sustainable security. it takes time to get some of these efforts. we saw ambassador mains make progress in el salvador but it was sustained, whole government efforts. >> and finally, general townsend, you wake up in the morning, what are the top three tha things that worry you most about your job? >> i think the first one is another event like amanda bay. an attack where we're just not looking for it. then i think what al-shabaab might do next that we're not tracking on out of east africa. and then just making sure i can do right by the soldier, sailors, airmen, and marines of africom. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you, all, especially for your service but thanks for being here to bring us up to speed. admiral faller, i want to talk about guantanamo just a little bit because we talked about deficiencies and the things you're trying to do there to get more accountability. my goodness. when it's costing $13 million per inmate. 13 million. what type of efficiency do you think you can do to cut into that? and how can we better operate? and don't you think it's time we look at repositioning these -- these prisoners? that would be more cost-effective to the american taxpayers. west virginians could do a lot with that one, i can assure you that one. in the short-term, efficiencies? >> senator, the humane legal treatment of those detainees is a top priority of ours. as part of this combatant command zero slate review, we are going to take a hard look at if there is a better way, more efficient way, to conduct that mission set. that review is ongoing. i'll report out to the secretary of defense soon. i believe -- >> let me just ask this question. and i'm sorry to interrupt you, sir. but have you all looked to see if we're capable and able? i understand we have quite a few detainees in united states prisons and some of our hardened facilities that would be more effective and efficient -- and i'm not saying the geopolitical ramifications of this thing, we just got to get more cost-effective here and do the commonsense thing. i can't explain this back home. >> as we look at our review, we're looking at different models and what we can learn from. as to whether we would move that detention facility, that's a policy decision that -- >> oh, i understand. i understand that. >> i just want to note, senator, that we remind our team, every day, that cole, uss cole, 9/11 and i know we were all deeply committed to ensuring we do right by that. and the united states needs the capability -- >> how many prisoners have you brought into guantanamo this last year? >> so we have currently 40. and that number's remained steady. >> so we haven't put any more there. >> we're not increasing that. >> we're not increasing at all. where are we putting them? our combatants. when we capture these combatants, where do we put them? >> the detainees that are being taken off the battlefield in other areas are being dealt with by separate, different -- >> not a $13 million a person you don't think, do you? >> i don't know the cost. >> i'm sorry, sir, on that. general townsend, if i can go to you, just give me a comparison. troop-wise, i think we're up to 80,000 in the middle east. deployment. >> i don't know the exact number. >> okay. nafcom, where are you in nafcom? >> today, we have about 150 service members and about 1,000 dod and civilian contractors. >> so we can say it's quite disproportionate, right? >> there's a difference. >> with extreme organizations, and al shabaab al qaeda and many more, the amount of manpower you have dealing with the influence of china now. you got your hands full there and it looks like we're spread pretty darn thin not being able to stop this in africa with what we see coming because it's not getting any less intense there and less violent and less threat to the united states of america. but most of everything we have is going towards -- is going towards the middle east. and also, on fighting the drugs that are coming to this country. and money going for different things besides the frontline of defense as far as stopping the drugs coming into our country. are you being hampered by the amount of resources you're able to -- to -- to call on? >> senator, as i mentioned previously, i think that the task we're given today, we're adequately resourced. with the exception of isr. and i think the defense-wide review -- >> so in order to do the mission, you think you're at 5,100 plus, you're in good shape. >> to do the task that we're assigned today. that's right. and i think the defense-wide review will, potentially, decrease the tasks that we have to do. >> you think the task could change? i mean -- >> i believe -- >> it's very mobile what's happening. >> the tasks we're assigned will change. >> yes. and by that could change as far as demand on resources, right? thank you, sir. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you, both, for your career and for willingness to hang in there and take up these responsibilities. as i see it, the world right now has four naval pitch points. you guys own two of them. now, the south china sea. i'm concerned about what -- and let's tau let's talk about suez in just a minute. if you look at what russia has done in syria and now they're talking about barbara down in djibouti. it's pretty obvious russia sin creasi is increasing their tempo in africa. i've been listening to this stuff for a while here and the thing i see beginning to develop is the opportunity that russia and china join together in an area where we are underdeployed and it creates a real strategic challenge for us. russia and china are members of the shanghai cooperative organization, along with india and pakistan. four nuclear powers. but in africa is one of the few places where i can see, other than the arctic, that they have the potential to really come together and create a real headache for us. would you share what russia is doing in your aor and how we should be thinking about it as we look toward the ndaa this next year? >> yes, senator. so i -- we provided some handouts there that kind of lay out graphically what russia is doing. you can see it's quite a bit. >> yes, sir. dramatically increased, wouldn't you say, over the last three years? >> oh, they have. they have. so i think russia's goals are predominantly for their benefit, for extractive resource extraction. they also want to position, particularly in northern africa, particularly in libya. they want to position on nato's southern flank there. they also, i think, want to thwart, you know, what we're trying to do and present themselves as a great power alternative to the united states. what i see them doing in -- is -- with china, though, we're not really seeing a great level of cooperation with one recent exception. there was a exercise a couple of months ago in south africa called exercise mosey where the south africans, the russians, and chinese navys conducted an exercise on the very southern tip of the continent. that's the very first visible sign of cooperation that we've seen. we're not seeing that in a great measure. but they're -- they're all over the continent. and they're doing mostly resource extraction. >> one of the things we don't talk about in here just to follow up real quick and i need to get to admiral faller about south america with a couple questions. but what are our nato allies doing in africa to help us stand up to the requirements we're trying to fulfill in your aor? >> senator, as you're aware, nato itself is not greatly active. >> i should've said the members of nato. thank you. >> members of nato are very involved. in fact, in the west africa, the -- we're a tertiary supporter of the french, buttressed by several other european countries there. in east africa and somalia, it's the european union that's keeping the amazon african forces in the field by paying for their -- paying for their sustainment in the field. so they -- european partners are doing quite a bit. i believe there is room for them to do more, and i think our government has recently called on europeans to do more. so has france, by the way. >> i'm really concerned -- your charts are great. the $145 billion already invested in africa and a plan to get to 250 billion in south america within the next five years by china alone. we put -- i think these numbers are directionally correct. we've put $8 billion of aid into something called power africa and i am making a point with this. we attracted something like $46 billion of foreign direct investment to back that up. so we've employed over $50 billion with only 8 of our seed money in there. leverage is a big part of this with our allies and we got to continue to do that. admiral, with regard to south america, 40 -- 56 ports they've already invested in. i'm worried about two things right now directly. in argentina, the georgia national guard is a partner down there. and you, in our meeting yesterday, talked about this a little bit. but tell us about the pla, china's pla, managing that space station in argentina. and then, secondarily, what is the up tempo mean that china has undertaken just since you've taken over in that aor? >> as -- as you state, beyond economic, china seeks to take their soft aims and -- and turn them into hard -- hard-power targets. and it's in space. it's in cyber. it's in port access. it's in access, generally, they signed into the previous panama administration some 40 agreements for access, influence including i.t. in panama. fortunately, for us, the current team in panama, the administration there, has changed policy and has recognized the threat that could -- could have on their sovereignty. we look up into the caribbean and one caribbean nation china has built a road across the country. 1,200 acres of access granted for chinese use. the equipment was brought in under less than -- under dubious circumstances. they parked it right next to the embassy so we'd be reminded of that. and now, they get to collect the tolls for 50 years on that road. and that -- there's just three quick examples of what we see with chinese influence. pivot and look into venezuela where china, russia, cuba, working alongside each other to block the forces and voices of democracy. particularly, in cyber. >> thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you, general and admiral, for being here. i apologize for being late. demands on our time these days are a little bit overwhelming. general townsend, first, let me just say that i join my colleagues in sending condolences to you and the families of those killed and injured in the attack on amanda bay. i especially want to point out and send our condolences to the family of army specialist mitch mayfield, who was a valued soldier in the first battalion. it's an amazing group down there and he was certainly part of that amazing group. admiral, i want to go back to something i think you may have touched on briefly with senator shaheen concerning the uss detroit and the literal combat ships that are being used. that ship was not made in alabama. we have a lot of the lcss made down in mobile that are employed around the world. and i'd like if you could tell me a little bit more about how the lcs has been helpful in the operations in your area. and how you might -- it -- is it possible to use -- or would you want additional lcss or other vessels like the epf to help in this -- in your area of expertise? >> so counternarcotics mission demands platforms for endgame working with law enforcement to -- to take both the detainees that we gain intel from and the drugs off the -- off the streets here in the u.s. detroit's had success in that endeavor. they have unmanned aerial vehicle fire scout embarked along with a helicopter. that is a great force package. we have also used the detroit off the coast of venezuela. waters that venezuela claims that international water did not recognize. detroit did a significant job sailing close to the coast of venezuela and providing that intelligence and reporting back to us. so the -- the ships are multi-mission. the ships are capable. unfortunately, had a rocky start. i think the kinks are being worked out. the detroit's performance since november has been above standards in all manners and reliability. and we welcome the deployment of the next combat ship to the region. we could use more of these ships that are well suited for the kind of missions in this hemisphere. >> great. well, thank you very much. and as -- as a former u.s. attorney, i'm -- you know, i'm acutely aware of the drug problem that we have in this country and the importation of drugs. and i'd like to do all we can and i have been concerned about the administrations of diverting some resources to what i think would be more appropriate for an addiction. but that's for another case and another discussion. i believe senator kaine may mention in american reassurance initiative. and i want to give you a chance to talk about that a little bit more, admirable. there's been discussion for years about developing a western hemisphere security initiative. but so far, we've just not been able to get it down. can you tell us what the status of those conversations is? and what impact that may or may not have on the future in your area? >> senator, proximity matters and this is our neighborhood. and when you can fly to central america shorter flights than washington, d.c., from miami is -- it's telling of how closely connected we are. and there's been various doctrines over the years. we had the good neighbor policy for fdr. we had the monroe doctrine. you know, i think there's -- there's been discussion by others, think tanks and senator kaine has mentioned it. i think -- i think there might be a big idea for this hemisphere where we take -- we -- we pull together the whole of government efforts necessary to recognize that these interior lines in military speak, this neighborhood matters. china and russia certainly recognize that. and to the extent that it takes resources, some of that resources is just our time and attention. and a little goes a long way. if it was a stock, it'd have a great pe ratio and you'd want to invest in it for the future. and the investments we've made are sound. i think we need to stay the course and look to where we can smartly increase and focus those investments. and a big idea associated with something like, as you mentioned, western hemisphere initiative might be a way to start. >> great. thank you, sir. and i would like to encourage you to stay in touch with my office about it. we're -- we're right there in alabama. right there on the gulf of mexico. so it is closer to us than a lot of folks. and my office is more than willing to help initiate those discussions or help develop those. so stay in touch and let us know. so thank you very much to both of you for your service and for being here today. thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. admiral, general, thank you for your service. thank you for being here today. admiral, let me start with you. my state of missouri has been deeply affected by the drugs coming into this country from latin america. your testimony's provided examples of certain latin american countries who are stepping up their effort on the counter-narcotics front. i am interested in who is maybe not pulling their weight. can you give us some examples of places where countries could be doing more? but are not doing so. have refused to do so. whether that's a result of corruption or other reasons. >> the -- these transnational criminal organizations, $90 billion they took in last year to fuel instability across the region. they have ungoverned territory in countries across the region and that bridges into the north com aor. and that's something we look at to the extent that we influence and leverage and put pressure on our partners to do more. unfortunately, the worst offender is not a country that we can cooperate with right now and that's venezuela. and we look at venezuela, where the regime's being propped up by cuba, russia, and china, and we see the narco trafficking that has increased substantially. in the air and over land from columbia into venezuela. and then it becomes extremely difficult to track as it leaves in commercial, privatized shipping, private airplanes. and so we look at countries stepping up and i think the international effort on pressure in maduro and that illegitimate regime is a focus area where we can do more. within the central american countries, i'd call out panama. the relationship missouri guard has with them. they've stepped up. costa rica stepped up. you've got another blight of no democracy in nicaragua, which is another problem site. el salvador's done more. guatemala's done more. some others can do more. they're working on it but certainly more effect that we can have from some of our partners. >> thank you very much. that's very helpful. general, let me turn to you. secretary esper has called on our european allies to do more in the sahel and he has said recently, could offset whatever changes we make as we consider next steps in africa. i'm wondering if you agree with that first and then i'm going to ask you to elaborate. but do you agree with that statement from the secretary? >> i do agree with the statement that european contributions could, in many ways, offset what we're doing there. >> could you -- could you give us just, on that point, general, some examples, specific examples of ways you think our nato allies could contribute more in the sahel than they currently are doing? >> well, sure. the french have called on their european neighbors to contribute more forces to the effort there trying to directly confront the violent extremist groups there in the sahel, specifically mali, burkina faso. and i that's something they can and should do. also, we're providing support that european countries have, specifically nato allies, have a capacity to do. airlift is something we're supporting the french forces with. air refueling for french fighter aircraft is another thing. and these are capacities that are resident in many european countries that they could provide. and i think our department's going to lead an effort to try to get some european partners to do some of those things and offset the support we're providing right now. i think they don't have the capacity to do some of the more technical types of support. we need some technical type intelligence support that's fairly exquisite and there's not a lot of countries that can do it at the same level. but they can mitigate a lot of the support we provide. >> thank you very much. general, let me ask you about china. i'm very concerned by the pla's presence in djibouti. do you worry that the pla could use its forces there to contest our ability to transit the adjacent waterways in a future crisis? >> on a daily basis, i don't worry a great deal about the chinese presence in djibouti at their base. but the potential is there. so we keep an eye on it. we're not blind to that. but there is a potential there in some future crisis that they could potentially use that base there to cause problems. >> let me just ask you, in your assessment, what should we be doing now to assure our access to that maritime chokepoint in a future scenario? >> i think we're doing that to a great extent. and that is competing. making sure that those countries that are there, djibouti being one of them, somalia being another one, those countries prefer the united states as a strategic partner. what -- what -- i'm not saying that they shouldn't interact with china or russia at all. but what i -- what i want is at 2:00 in the morning when the secretary of state calls, head of state in africa, and says america needs to come in tonight. they say yes to us and they don't say yes to the chinese or the russians. >> my time has expired. admiral, i want to ask you a few questions about the chinese activity. i'll submit those for the record. thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you, mr. chairman. general townsend, general who assumed the position as the head of iran's quds force after soleimani's killing has vowed to strike back at the united states and called on hezbollah to exact further revenge. the voice of america reported earlier this month that iran may seek to strike back in africa. and the potential of softer targets. what have you been doing to ensure the safety of our service members? and american citizens in africa? and, second, how have plans to reduce u.s. forces in africa accounted for the possible increase in future terrorist activity? how well-equipped and trained are forces in africa? >> center to your first question, we are following those reports. there is intelligence reporting that with that that both the quds force and lebanese hezbollah, i think, are looking for opportunities to strike back at america, wherever. and we think one of those places is certainly africa. we're watching and listening carefully for that. we're not taking any specific measures yet. don't really have a good enough picture to take actions. but we are watching and listening for that. then, on your second question, the -- the -- the quality of african security forces varies widely depending on where we're talking about in africa. so some are exceptionally good, and others are not so good. and, you know, the partners that we work with, trying to get them all to a level where they can at least be self-sufficient would be the ideal. they could handle their own security threats on their own. >> we -- i took a codel a few years ago and we did stop in chad to assess our support and how well they were doing to support nigeria. do you have any thoughts about how that relationship is developing? is it moving forward? or is it retreated? >> i think that relationship is pretty sound. there's a multinational joint task force that operates there. all those countries around the lake chad basin are operating there. chad has recently redeployed some forces from nigeria. but that was part of a scheduled move, not some sort of breakdown in the -- in the relationship or the partnership there in the joint task force. so i think that that -- that group is still -- is functioning. >> okay. earlier this month, the al shabaab launched an attack on manda air field. "new york times" reported that al-shabaab used the attack as a message to african forces that american troops would abandon them just as they did with the syrian kurds. at the same time, a report stated that the activity of africa's extremist groups has doubled since 2013. how has the decision to withdrawal support from syria impacted the resolve and trust of our african partners? >> i don't know that the -- our decision to withdrawal from syria has affected their calculus. that has not come up in any discussions i've had with african leaders. but, you know, the thing that they're all always looking for is can we count on you as a partner? but i haven't heard that they're looking towards our withdrawal from syria as -- as some indication. >> and do you have any plans, at this point, or any strategies to reduce our forces in africa? and what do you think the impact of those reductions could be in our counterterrorism efforts? >> so we're engaged in this blank-slate review process with the department of defense. and i think that's a necessary and a good process to do to make sure that our resources are always pointed at our highest priorities. we've made some presentations to, and recommendations to, the secretary of defense. he's still in a decision cycle and i don't want to get in front of his decision about what may happen with our troop presence on the continent. i will say that there are threats to america that will emanate from the african continent, great power threats, as well as violent extremist organizations. >> a quick question in my remaining time on china. both china and russia have been making large economic investments in both africa and latin america in order to expand their influence around the globe. when we were in africa, they were investing in djibouti and doing a huge investment in the airfield there. this is yet another example of how the battle for world leadership this century cannot be fought by just spending more money on weapons. instead, we have to learn lessons from the failures in iraq and afghanistan and build lasting relationships and partnerships. what role do your co-coms play in any whole of government coordination aimed at aligning all of our levels -- levers of powers towards a common goal in your respective aors? >> with the -- what you said about china and russia, it's so key, senator. we've seen it in cuba. 90 miles from key west where china and russia working alongside -- certainly, not for u.s. national interest or for any partnerships in the hemisphere. but our partnerships are key. and working with our partners to build strong institutions, it's these institutions that do the right thing and have trust and respect the rule of law and human rights. and we have a human rights office in -- in southcom that we staff to work on these sorts of things that are part of professionalism and part of trust building. >> senator, i just say that our whole of government, we are -- our level of resourcing is such that if we're going to get anything done for america on the african continent, we have to do it as a whole of government. working with the department of state and usaid. that's just in our dna how we operate every day. >> thank you, mr. chairman. >> i want to talk about the biggest and the most important story in the world. the wuhan coronavirus. this coronavirus is a catastrophe on the scale of chernobyl for china. but actually, it's probably worse than chernobyl, which was localized in its effect. the coronavirus could result in a global pandemic. while you were all sleeping overnight, the number of diagnosed cases in china increased by 30%. now, let me be clear. that's not new cases. that is just newly admitted cases. it is probably several orders of magnitude higher than that. also, while you were sleeping, china now has its entire border with russia closed. 2,600 miles. russia has closed that border. shut down travel between israel and china. air france has shut down travel between china and france. and that's in addition to all the other countries that have already shut down travel. from what we know so far, and there is still many unknowns, this virus could have both a long incubation period. as much as 14 days. and individuals could be contagious while asymptomatic, which was not the case with sars in 2003. furthermore, from some cases, it appears the virus could be aerosolized, which means it doesn't require the kind of contact that you have with, say, a married couple kissing each other or a family living in close quarters in a hotel or apartment. but rather, the distances we are all sitting apart right now. yet, china is still lying about all of this. they've been lying about it from the very beginning. and you don't need their history of lying about sars in 2003, though it is relevant here. you just have to see what's happened over the last two months. we now know that the first case manifested no later than -- no later than december 1. even though china didn't reveal it to the w.h.o. until a month later on december 31st. when they continued to hide it from their own citizens. and they continued to say that it had been contained inside wuhan. today, it is in every single province in china. they also claimed, for almost two months until earlier this week, that it had originated in a seafood market in wuhan. that locals had contracted it from animals and, say, bat soup or snake tartar. that is not the case. the lands published last weekend demonstrating that of the original 40 cases, no contact with the seafood market. as one epidemiologist said it went into the seafood market before it came out of the seafood market. could have been a farm. could have been a food processing company. i would note that china -- that wuhan also has china's only biosafety level 4 super laboratory that works with the world's most deadly pathogens, to include, yes, coronavirus. now, look at china's own actions. they have quarantined 60 million people. 60 million. more than the entire population of our west coast. they have shut down schools indefinitely. classes cancelled nationwide, indefinitely. hong kong, a part of china, has basically shut down all travel from the mainland. that's why it is essential that we immediately stop all travel on commercial aircraft between china and the united states. making exceptions, of course, for american citizens to come back, as we just brought back yesterday. allowing a central trade to flow, as long as crews on ships and aircraft are not allowed to go into the general population america, and making exceptions of course for medical personnel to go into china to try to get a handle on this. it is essential that we take those steps. and essential that we get to the bottom of china's deceit and incompetence on this measure. and, gentlemen, i raise this with you because you're responsible in your combatant commands for some countries that have the most fragile public institutions, to include the most fragile public health institutions in the world. so i ask, even though as of this morning, there are not yet confirmed cases of coronavirus in your combatant commands, though i suspect there will be soon. what is your assessment about the ability of the governments in your combatant commands to handle a potential global pandemic like this, general townsend? >> thanks, senator. so there are not, that i'm aware of, any confirmed cases, as you mentioned. but there are some suspected cases. the first suspected -- report of suspected case i heard of is in djibouti, which you would imagine with the significant chinese presence there. so the -- the capacity of african nations to deal with this problem varies widely. for example, in eastern africa, central east africa, there's -- they've been dealing with ebola. and they've been dealing with ebola, largely, on their own and doing a pretty good job of it. so i think capacity there. but anywhere else in africa is probably not to that degree. >> admiral faller? >> the venezuela crisis has already strained the social services of many of the nations, as you are aware. senator, we had to deploy the hospital ship comfort twice in one year last deployment 12 different nations. and in one five-day span, it can do the equivalent of a whole month for a region of some of the major countries. so i would be extremely concerned. like general townsend, the capacities vary widely. but i'd be very concerned if we saw this spread. >> thank you. as a defensive measure, i just say, again, it is essential that we shut down all commercial air travel immediately between the united states and china. as an offensive measure, because that probably won't stop it entirely and because if it becomes a global pandemic, we have to deal with countries with very limited capabilities here. we need a manhattan project level effort to work with our best research scientists and laboratories in this country to develop a vaccine as quickly as possible. the democratic presidential candidates have campaigned throughout iowa. canvassing for votes leading up to the iowa caucuses. now, it's time for the resultingresults. watch our live coverage of the iowa caucuses today starting at 7:30 p.m. eastern on c-span. online at c-span.org or listen live on the free c-span radio app. clerk will call the role. >> mr. cohen. mr. gohmert? >> my vote is no. >> mr. chairman, there are 23 yeas. >> article i is adopted. >> pontious pilot. >> the president's crimes are impeachable. >> because you just don't like the guy. you didn't like him since november of 2016. >> make it be very clear that this president will be held accountable. that no one is above the law. >> and the question is now whether senator mcconnell will allow a fair trial in the senate. >> president, the house's hour is over. the senate's time is at hand. >> each of us will face a choice about whether to begin this trial in a search of the truth or in the service of the president's desire to cover up. >> do you solemnly swear that in all things appertaining to the trial of the impeachment of donald john trump, president of the united states, now pending. >> you will do impartial justice according to the constitution and laws so help you god? >> since the president was sowon into office, there was a desire to see him removed. >> the impeachment of president trump. watch unfiltered coverage of the senate trial on c-span2, live, with same-day re-airs. follow the process on demand at c-span.org/impeachment. and listen on the go using the free c-span radio app. victory is not winning for our party. victory is winning for our country. >> president trump delivers his state of the union address from the house chamber. live, tuesday, at 8:00 p.m. eastern. followed by the democratic response with michigan governor gretchen whitmer and texas representative veronica escobar. live coverage on c-span. on demand at c-span.org or listen on the free c-span radio app. >> up next on c-span, a house hearing about disinformation campaigns on social media. the head of global policy management for facebook testified, alongside several researchers who studied the issue. illinois congresswoman
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