Transcripts For CSPAN Washington Journal Morgan Chalfant Andrew Desiderio 20240714

Available wherever books are cspan. O t thepresident. Joining us for a discussion his morning is the National Security reporter for the hill newspaper, Congress National politico it all gets under way at 8 30 a. M. Tomorrow in the house Judiciary Committee. Tomorrow and the housy committee explain what they will be covering. Guest they will focus on volume two of the report, exclusively on the idea the president was seeking to obstruct the mother investigation. A lot of democrats, even the chairman of the committee, jerry nadler, said the evidence is clear the president at least sought to obstruct the investigation. The decision was made not to charge the president with a crime in part because of the office of Legal Counsel opinion that we have been talking about that states you cannot indict a sitting president. The only way to hold a sitting president accountable would be outside of the criminal justice system. Those are the Judiciary Committee issues. The big issue that will be on everyones mind is impeachment and whether the house Judiciary Committee will move toward that immediately after the hearing. That remains to be he seen. Host take us through the formats of the hearing. Guest it will be three hours, which is a little shorter than usual. The hearing was supposed to be last week and even shorter than that. It was supposed to be two hours, but the committee was able to negotiate with special counsel mueller for more time, an extra hour, allowing, they believe, all Committee Members to ask questions. If it was two hours, the bottom rung of the committee would not be able to question mueller. Tomorrow, it will be a regular hearing, mueller will make Opening Statements, and the doj will not see the Opening Statement in advance. We dont know when he will submit the statement, but those are things we will watch for. Host explain the order of questions here and who sits on the top wrong versus the bottom rung. Guest the top wrong is the most senior members of the committee, folks who have served in committee for the longest. The bottom is mostly the freshman members and those who were just place on the committee of this congress. They were concerned they might not be able to ask questions, which is why we are having the hearing tomorrow instead of last wednesday. Essentially, it will be a regular hearing in a sense that they hope all members will be able to ask questions. As a general rule that each member gets to ask questions for five minutes. It depends of republicans or even democrats might try to filibuster that and sort of push the time back and prevent more junior members from asking questions. As currently scheduled, they should get five minutes. Host will the public be allowed in and what are the rules for the media . Guest the public will be allowed in, but it is a small room. It will be a little difficult in that sense, and the media will be allowed in. I believe they are allowing one person per outlets. It will be a really small room. The media will come in, the public will come in, i remember the last time we had a hearing like this. I think morgan and i were sitting next to each other. It was the Michael Cohen hearing. That one was such a small room, you could feel the tension in the room because everybody was on pins and needles listening to every word Michael Cohen said. I thing that feeling and since we got during that hearing will be exponentially greater when Robert Mueller enters the room. Host that is the Judiciary Committee starting at 8 30 a. M. Tomorrow. We will aerate live here on cspan and on cspan air its live here on cspan3 and on cspans radio app. New, the action turns to the house Intelligence Committee. Explain what they will be looking at and why. Guest there will be a short break and the Intel Committee will convene in the same room. They will be focused on volume one of the report, which analyzes russian attempts to interfere in the election and Trump Campaign parts contact figures,ia, primary and i expect lawmakers to drill on those contacts, and democrats , why they believe them to raise National Security risks or implications, and why they see the contacts as nefarious. Mueller did not charge anyone associated with the campaign with conspiring with russia to interfere in the election, but the democrats say many of those contacts or troubling. The Trump Campaign sought russia they welcomed the wikileaks releases of Hillary Clintons emails, so i expect them to drill down on that. Host why will they be in the same room, and does that change the format for the smaller Intelligence Committees and larger Judiciary Committee . Guest that was part of the agreement they struck when they came to Robert Mueller. As andrew mentioned, they pushed back the hearing under a new agreement, which allow the Judiciary Committee more time. The Intel Committee will get two hours, the original agreement. That will give every member to ask a chance to ask questions. Everyone will have fiveminute rounds. The Intel Committee is much smaller than judiciary, 22 members. Host the chairman of the Intel Committee, how do you think his style is different than the chairman of the Judiciary Committee. Guest one thing interesting about the Intelligence Committee is that most or much of its work is conducted behind closed doors and classified sessions. Do chairman has tried to more public hearings. I think we have had a couple, including a few, focused on the mother investigation and russian interference mother investigation and russian erterference muell investigation and russian interference. It is proceeding second. I think we will get a lot of tower from the first hearing. Even in that switchover, though it is in the same room, will they change out the members of the public allowed in and what does that mean for Media Coverage . Guest im not sure about the public. The Media Coverage will stay the same. I believe the public will get their seats clutched to them as the hearing proceeds. The media, as andrew said, one chair per outlet. I think it was first come first serve, so some outlets might have been left short if they did not rsvp. Host some information on the two committees where these hearings will be taking place tomorrow morning, starting with the house Judiciary Committee. 41 members, 21 democrats, 17 er is 35 yearsb youngest member is 35 years old. Member, and the oldest member on the oldest member on that ommittee welch, hes 72, the youngest member is a republican from new york. 35 years old. Those hearingsng in this hour of the washington journal and we want to hear your questions. Your comments, for our panel to reporters who have been covering and outs of the Mueller Investigation. Phone lines are open. You can call in. Report. ,epublicans are 202 7488000 democrats are 202 7488001, independents are 202 7488002. Take us through the story that you are part of, andrew. The Justice Department telling mueller to limit his report. Guest we knew even before yesterday Robert Mueller was not comfortable testifying beyond the four corners of his report. He stated that publicly on may 29. He even resisted the idea of testifying in the first place, which is why he had to be subpoenaed. The doj has communicated to mueller that when you testify on wednesday, your testimony must remain within the bounds of your report. You cant talk about the deliberative process, why you reached certain legal conclusions, the evidence you gather, how you gathered it. A lot of that is classified, and would have been shield in any way, but democrats are trying to get at specific questions for special counsel mueller, including the main overarching question which is this idea of whether mueller would have charged the president with obstruction of justice if donald trump was not sitting in the oval office. That goes to what i mentioned, the office of Legal Counsel opinion, things you cannot indict a sitting president. This is a directive from the doj to Robert Mueller that reaffirms his personal, previous bowel which says i would not vow which says i would not go beyond the previous report. Host isnt rubber mold of the isnt Robert Mueller the former special counter . Guest mueller is a private citizen now, so he doesnt have to abide by the doj. This is in line with what he has already said, he said his report is his testimony. He will not engage in hypotheticals about the president , so that is why you dont expect them to answer any version of that question, would trump have been indicted if you want president. Its consistent with what mueller has said, but im sure democrats will be angry at the doj because the doj is seen as trying to limit muellers testimony, even if he wants to go outside of the confines of the report. , if hendrew desiderio does do that, is there a way the department of justice can enforce the objective. Guest they are relying on mueller to self police. It is a public hearing, so there is nothing stopping a member of the department of justice, a lawyer from the doj, from going into the hearing and being there, but this individual will not be sitting at the table with mueller, lodging objections to certain questions. We have seen the administration do that with other witnesses testifying before the Judiciary Committee as part of the obstruction investigation. They will, as far as we know, not have recourse or means to prevent mueller from answering questions. It looks like they will rely on him to self police remarks. Host you both mentioned about what Robert Mueller said he what said what he would and would not do. That is the moment from the may press conference in which he talked about this. I expect this to be the only time i will speak to you in this manner. Myselfking that decision , no one has told me whether i can or should testify cant or should testify or speak further about this matter. There has been discussion about an appearance before congress. Any testimony from this office would not go beyond our report. Findings andur analysis, and the reasons for the decisions. We chose those words carefully, and the work speaks for itself. The report is my testimony. I would not provide information beyond that which is already public in any appearance before congress. In addition, access to the underlying work product is being decided in a process that does not involve our office. Beyond what ive said here today, and what is contained in our written work, i do not believe it is appropriate for me to speak further about the investigation, or to comment on the actions of the Justice Department or congress. For that reason, i will not be taking questions today as well. Host thats Robert Mueller taking questions tomorrow starting at 8 30 in the house Judiciary Committee. You can watch it on cspan3 and here on cspan live coverage starting at 8 30 in the morning tomorrow. This morning, we are chatting about that hearing, previewing it here and taking your phone calls. We are chatting with Morgan Chalfant with the hill newspaper and Andrew Desiderio from politico. This is jeffrey out of auburn, new york. A democrat. Jeffrey, go ahead. Jeffrey, are you with us this morning . Caller yes i am. I have two comments. The first is a comment on the profitability of the Mueller Investigation. I believe there is about a 10 return on what we spend on this investigation, which was in the neighborhood of 180 million. I believe the last stat i heard was forfeitures and fines equal 210 million, which is a 10 return on investment, a pretty good return if you ask me. The second comment is, a joke, and i believe it is totally clean. What is the difference between arguing a point with a republican and banging your head against a brick wall . Host dont make me regret it. What is your answer . Caller at least, when you quit banging your head against a brick wall, one mind was changed. Host that is a democrat in new york. Andrew desiderio on the cost of the molar investigation. Guest i think he is referring of hispresident , one criticisms is a waste of taxpayer funds. If you look at what was seized as part of the investigation, the prosecution, Paul Manafort and the fines levied against individuals, it has made money for the u. S. That cuts across the president s main criticism. I think it was Paul Manaforts trump tower apartment which the government now owns. He had suits that costed thousands and thousands of dollars. Not sure who is going to get them, but that is another example of how this investigation has made money. Host to make sure we have the numbers right, i think the viewer was talking about hundreds of millions of dollars, and i think the cost is more in the tens of millions of dollars. In september of last year, the number that sticks out is 25 million. Guest and of course that was last september. The investigation stretched into march. I expected was more than that, 25 somewhere in the range of million to 35 million. Host walter is a republican. Good morning. Caller thank you for taking my call and i appreciate the guests they guest and the information they will provide. I heard that three years, after the mother report is out ler reportrt muel is out, trump would get impeached. You had the wolves against trump. Person, every single this evidence, wait until you see it. The day comes and they are ready to go with collusion, collusion, and then you heard a big poof. Everything was quiet, they looked around at each other like, wait a minute, what did they say . They were jumping up and down, and now we are doing these rounds again. To me, the only collusion, the way i seen it, was when hillary delsea paid for a fake fake dossier. And the pfizer court never said it was a dossier eight up by foreign intelligence agents, and hillary used it. It is comical and will be a dog and pony show. They will say we got him again been nobody has again, lets nobody has n i wish these knuckleheads on the democrats side would get together and work with the president for the good of the country. Host i got your point, walter. This is volume one of the molar report Mueller Report about conspiracy. The investigation establish multiple links between the Trump Campaign officials and individuals tied to the russian government. Those legs included russian offers of assistance to the campaign in some instances. The campaign was receptive to the offer, and in other instances, the campaign shied away. They did not establish the campaign coordinated or conspired with the russian government in its election interference activities. Guest i will say the term collusion, muellers report said evaluateot did not conclusion. He evaluated conspiracy. Theefines coordination, and investigation did not charge anyone associated with the Trump Campaign with conspiring with russia to interfere in the elections. Mueller notes that members of the Campaign Welcomed wikileaks ils, your mail releases email releases, and sought more information about them. It is more than a blackandwhite issue of whether the campaigns compared come or colludedd with russia. What he found in terms of the contacts and how congress is focused on how you make it so this sort of thing doesnt happen again, in terms of a Foreign Government interfering in the election, and how we bolster our laws so people report any efforts that could be part of that foreign interference. Host this was President Trump from the oval office yesterday, asked about his thoughts about tomorrows molar hearings mueller hearings. Pres. Trump , no i wont be watching. I wont be watching mueller, because you cant take all of those bites out of the apple. We had no collusion, no obstruction, no nothing. We had a total no collusion finding. The democrats were devastated by it. They went crazy and got off of the deep end. They are not doing health care or anything, not doing infrastructure, not lowering drug prices. Im lowering drug prices. The first time in 53 years at drug prices went down last year. 53 years, and im doing it without the help of congress, which makes it tougher to do, because if they worked with us, i could get drug prices down to half, but the democrats dont care about drug prices. All they care about is a phony investigation where the report was written. Its a no collusion. The report was written, and the attorney general, based on the report, was able to find there was no obstruction. There was no nothing. They are wasting their time. Robert mueller, i know he is conflicted. Hes got a lot of conflicts, including the fact that his best friend is comey, but he has big conflict with me. As you know, he wanted the job of the fbi director and did not get it. We had a business relationship where i said no, and i would say he was not happy. All of a sudden, he gets this position. You know what, he still rules and i respect him for it. He still ruled no collusion, no obstruction, and this thing should have ended a long time ago. This has been going on for 2. 5 years. We will never allow this to happen to another president again. Host that was President Trump yesterday in the oval office. Andrew desiderio, a lot there. Guest no collusion, no obstruction. That is what the president has set ever since the report came out. Mueller said neither of those things. The first point, collusion was never evaluated. Collusion is not a legal term or anything part of the deliberative process when you are racing a prosecutorial decision. What mueller did say is that there was not enough evidence to charge a vast conspiracy with the russians interfering in the american election. That is the first part. The second part, mueller said no obstruction. He said this report does not exonerate the president , and if we had confidence the president did not commit a crime, we would have so stated. Host the exact wording from all you too, if we had confidence after a thorough investigation of the facts of the president clearly did not commit obstruction of justice, we would so state, based on the facts and applicable standards, we were unable to reach that judgment accordingly. While this does not conclude that the president committed the crime, it does not also exonerate him. Guest mueller laid out one dozen potential instances of obstruction of justice. At least five of which met three elements required for an obstruction of justice charge. Mueller was saying donald trump, in these instances, again, this is an allegation essentially, he met all three elements that would be required in order to charge someone with obstruction of justice. In the next section, he went his legal theories and mentioned the office of Legal Counsel opinion, which states you cannot indict a sitting president. That is what the report said. It is easy for the president and his political allies to dismiss it all as no collusion and no obstruction, which is an over simplification and mostly false. Host one thing from the president s statement, the business relationship with Robert Mueller, what is he referring to . Guest i think it is something to do with mueller and his golf club and a membership of some sort. Host the Trump Golf Club . Guest i think. Im not entirely sure. I know it is something to do with a golf club. He said mueller was angry because he didnt get the fbi job. Remember, Christopher Wray had said and spoken highly about Robert Mueller. Folks across the aisle speak highly about Robert Mueller, so when people say he is highly conflicted or has members on his Campaign Investigation that have donated to democrats, there is no evidence that motivated them in a biased way. And he is a registered republican. Host Christopher Wray will be on capitol hill today before the senate Judiciary Committee, one of the oversight hearings on the fbi. We are airing that live on 10 00 a. M. On cspan3 and cspan radio. You can watch it on cspan. Org. There is speculation that that might be a preview for lines of questioning for tomorrow, for Robert Mueller. Our next caller is out of arkansas, democrat. Good morning. Caller hello. I guess i would like [indiscernible] i dont think they will get much out of mr. Mueller. Refused to come up and testify, barr, and they wouldnt have gotten anything out of them anyway. Talk guys know how to around questions and use the time up. I think the man they need to subpoena and get up there is alan weiss oberg. He was mentioned by Michael Cohen when he testified before the Judiciary Committee. He is a moneyman in the trump organization. Michael mentioned him several times cohen mentioned him several times. I dont know why they havent called him up there. It has been three months since cohen was there and they havent burg yet. Isl these professionals like mueller, that is a waste of time. Youll be watching anyway guys know what happened with the Deutsche Bank subpoenas that they were supposed to get trump s income tax records from them. I lost track of that. Host Andrew Desiderio, you are shaking your head there. Guest thats right. The House Oversight ashley house Intelligence Committee and the House Financial Services Committee House Intelligence Committee and the house initial Services Committee one that case, but it is going through the appeals process. We should get a ruling in the next couple of months. It is unlikely the challenge would go to the supreme court, but as of now, the president will lose that case. There is a separate one for maize are partial usa maizar s usa. They also won that case and it is going through the appeals process. It looks like House Democrats are on solid legal ground in requesting this information, but right now, we are waiting for it to go through the court system. Host the caller talked about who he hopes will testify before the house judiciary and Intelligence Committee. Here is a running list of who has testified on the russia investigation. On the Judiciary Committee, since 20, we have heard from ,eff sessions, Rod Rosenstein Christopher Wray and Rod Rosenstein testified together, Matt Whitaker testified in february of 2019. Hope picks testified behind closed doors. For the Judiciary Committee, people they havent heard from mcgahn,iam barr and don the White House Former white house attorney. Explain why we havent heard from them. Barr, the Judiciary Committee wanted staff to question him. Barr agreed to testify, as he did with the Judiciary Committee following the conclusion of muellers investigation, but he did not that she objected to the fact that the committee wanted Committee Staff to question him, so he invaded the appearance. They havent revisited that. With mcgann, they subpoenaed him in may and he did not show up on obstruction from trump, which, waving a Legal Counsel opinion, mcgahn was immune from testimony. They are preparing to go to court to enforce the subpoena, but we have not seen a lawsuit yet, probably because the houses overwhelmed with fighting other legal battles. Host for the Intelligence Committee since 2017, viewers will remember that former chairman, the republican chairman of the committee at the time, devin nunes, launched his russia investigation in 2017. A lot of testimony behind closed doors. George kushner, michael stone, devin nunes released his report on the russian report in 2018. Since the new chairman has taken over, a new investigation, Michael Cohen has testified behind closed doors. Guest felix seiter is a russian born businessman who was the main negotiator of the trump tower moscow project. With the Michael Cohen situation, one of the reasons he was behind bars was that he lied to the house Intelligence Committee about the timing of the negotiation surrounding the moscow project. Felix seiter came in last month and he overslept his first appearance area he claims he overslept, but he came under subpoena, the committee claims he has not provided the documents required under that subpoena, but he is a key player in this whole issue of how the donaldrganization and trump being involved in the campaign trying to create this brandnew vast real estate project in moscow. Host robert is in pennsylvania, a republican. Good morning. Caller good morning and thank you for taking my call. I have this to say. I would like to know how much more money of the taxpayers of the democrats are going to spend beating a dead horse. The Mueller Investigation was done, it is over with. Move on. They are only trying to keep this fresh because they think that that will let people vote for the democrats instead of President Trump, and they are wrong. Host that is robert from pennsylvania. Morgan chalfant, we talked about the cost of the Mueller Investigation. Do we know about the cost of Committee Probes on russia . Guest im not sure of the cost, but i will say that one thing democrats have hammered across is that they want to have these hearings, particularly with mueller, so the public knows what it in the report. We know not a lot of people are reading the report. It is 448 pages of legal jargon, and i think they want to bring aspects of muellers report to light so that the public is more informed. That is why they see an important in this, and really forward on investigation on the president s conduct, particularly because mueller said he did not even answer the question or approach the question of whether trump engaged in criminal wrongdoing because of the Justice Department legal opinion. Host staying in pennsylvania, sandy, independent, good morning. Caller thank you for taking my call. I have been listening, and i read the report. Im one of the 3 of american citizens who read the report. That reports can be interpretative so many different ways, just like the bible is. My point is, when you hear everybody saying, but there was obstruction, the obstruction, in my opinion, if they dig into the obstruction, they will find that there is dirty hands on the democrats side. Im tired of this. I am an independent and will not tell you who i voted for, or who im planning to vote for, but this will turn into a circus yet again tomorrow, maybe not in the morning, but the minute the afternoon session starts, it will be bashing trump. Just like they did with cavanaugh kavanaugh. Host why do you think its more likely in the house Intelligence Committee rather than the house judiciary . Guest because they seem to be caller because they seem to be more vocal in trump eight and their supporters. Didid any that your opinion change from before you read it to after you read it . Caller before i read it, i was on the democratic side. After i read it, i am now fully in support of President Trump. Host that is sandy in pennsylvania. Andrew desiderio, what do you want to take from it. Guest first off, i have not heard someone acknowledge like that that they have read the Mueller Report, at least a member of the general public. Even members of congress have not they have admitted on the record that they have not fully read the report. What i will say is that it is 448 pages, difficult to get through, reporters like us have read through it and picked it apart because it is necessary for our jobs and the investigations going on on capitol hill, but i think one thing the democrats are worried about is the criticism we just heard, this idea you are trying to relitigate the 2016 election, the idea democrats are essentially trying to do this to impeach the president. Democrats feel like even if they dont impeach the president , they can do a public airing of these allegations so the American Public can be more informed about the president s alleged actions and the democrats can help in the 2020 election. That is Nancy Pelosis approach. You can wound donald trump enough politically. One of the criticisms is that it might go too far. Host in terms of seeing it and hearing it, as opposed of reading it. He are two editorials in todays national papers. Usa today editorial board, get ready for the audio version of the molar report is the title Mueller Report is the title of their editorial. I want to hear your thoughts on phone lines for democrats, republicans, and independents. Segment,s left in this but we will continue talking about the Mueller Report. Florida, an democrat. Good morning. Caller greetings. , and a koreanold war veteran. I dont want to grow under the grass until trump is no longer a factor. Quotes i wishief to put on the table for comment. The first two are from john adams the second adams, the second president of the United States. Host why dont we just go with those two. Go ahead. Caller the first one, our constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. The second quote, remember, democracy never lasts long. Exhausts, and, murders itself. Yete never was a democracy that did not commit suicide. Host that is worn in florida. Asking viewers to respond to that as well, as we ask viewers to call in with your questions and comments about tomorrows highprofile Robert Mueller hearings at 8 30. You can watch it here on cspan, on cspan3 as well, and cspan. Org, listen to it on the free cspan radio app. Kathy in cuyahoga falls, ohio. An independent. Good morning. Caller thank you. Im so glad i got through. I wanted to say, to me, it is a nobrainer to do an impeachment investigation. I think what really bothers me is that these things they are saying that trump and his people dead were in pursuit of becoming president , so the limitation of not being able to indict a appealnt, i think we can to not have to abide by that, because of the things he did were in pursuit of becoming president , so for him to hide behind the presidency and not be indicted seems wrong to me, and i would love to hear your comment on that. Host thats morgan on the limitation host Andrew Desiderio host Morgan Chalfant on that. Guest that is what mueller has said, preventing him from answering the question on whether or not trump engaged in criminal wrongdoing. He said because of the longstanding olc opinion the a sitting president that a that the olc opinion sitting president cant be indicted. Host what is that . Guest it is the office of Legal Counsel at the department. So not reaching a conclusion, one way or another on that, as andrew mentioned, the report specifically states it does not exonerate trump, but mueller has not said explicitly if it indict meant an indictment. Whats a lot of people have on their mind, and i dont expect euler to report it. Host our next caller is a democrat. Good morning. Caller thank you for taking my call. One question i would like mueller to be asked is, why did he take this job if he is so shy or timid about talking about his work . Thank you, and i will listen to your comments about that, please. Host Andrew Desiderio on the personality of Robert Mueller. Guest weve heard from lawmakers who have grilled mueller in the past as he served as fbi director for 12 years. He knows what he is doing on capitol hill. He mastered the art of the dodge, as i have written before, and he has been described as someone who is a creature of the department. He is someone who believes it is not his job to satisfy the partisan wishes of either party. It is his job to put out the facts and let everyone else decide for themselves. That is part of his philosophy. Or, what is governing his philosophy at least, initially not wanting to testify before congress. It had to come to a subpoena for him. He had to be subpoenaed for him to come before congress. He would not want to defy a subpoena, so he complied, and entered into a negotiation. Known as a rule what the adhering to Justice Department wants and what he believes is the overarching philosophy of the Justice Department, an independent agency and that officials should not try to satisfy the partisan wishes of either party. Host Robert Mueller has 152 videos in the cspan archive if you want to check out those and see what it is like for Robert Mueller to testify on capitol hill. Heres one example of that, before the house to gia sherry house Judiciary Committee. This will be an 2012, in exchange of bobby scott bobby using torture. The United States participated in waterboarding, a practice which has an International Consensus constituting torture. What was the fbi participation in that practice . None. And why was the fbi not participating . Is that because our guidelines, the guidelines we adopted some years ago preclude our participation. And did you issue an order for them not to participate in what is generally perceived to be torture . The guidance was make certain that we follow our guidelines when it comes to interrogation persons in our custody or the custody of others. Preventedr conscience the fbi from participating in torture, is that right . I dont want to characterize. Our guidelines precluded it and our guidance was follow guidelines. Host Andrew Desiderio host Morgan Chalfant, what should we take from that exchange . Guest it is classic Robert Mueller from one members of congress and people who know him and worked with him say about him. He is very by the book. You can tell his language, he is very good at dodging questions, it is very formal, talking about the guidance and not talking about his conscience or opinions. That is what i expect tomorrow. It remind me of his press conference on may 29 and reminds me of statements from his report. I think tomorrow will be a heated hearing, emotional, we will have lawmakers trying to get him off of his feet at times probably. I dont think he will respond to that or engage in it. This is something that has somebody that has had so much practice and preparation ahead of this hearing. Former fbi chief, the professional he always has been, and really try to preserve the nonpolitical, just the facts persona. Host more coming up in about 15 minutes on the personality and life of rubber mueller. We will be joined by Robert Mueller. We will be joined by mattathias schwartz, who has written a profile on Robert Mueller and interviewed many of the people who have worked with him over the years. Stick around for that discussion at the top of the hour at 9 00 a. M. Eastern. Isaac is in baltimore, maryland. An independent. Good morning. Caller i have a comment and a question. Has an independent that read the Mueller Report as well. Two things, i hear a lot of your colors talking about the whole colors talking about the whole no collusion callers talking about no collusion. The first thing you will learn, rubber mueller, was never trying to Robert Mueller, was never trying to investigate collusion. Mueller, during the report, was trying to figure out how russian interfered with our election, and to see if there were any u. S. Citizens that conspired, from the legal term, with russia. If that did not happen, what we did find out was that there was ethical problems that were rehashed on people arrested, but the one thing i saw was that, before donald trump became president , and after he became president , there was a serious ethical lapse of judgment from the entire Trump Campaign from the top down. Because of that ethical lapse of judgment, it warrants at least an impeachment inquiry. Heres my question. My question is that, what do american citizens do if we are being shown, factually, that a culture can have a certain level of courage, do whatever they want to do, and get away with it. How are we, as american citizens, supposed to continue to be correct citizens and abide by the law, if we are being shown that not only can a person possibly commit a crime, but then when they commit a crime, obstruction of justice or didnt find solution but we see obstruction of justice host do you think impeachment should be on the table right now . Caller i believe impeachment an impeachment inquiry should be on the table. After reading the report, i saw what i would think as obstruction of justice before and after he became president. Host Andrew Desiderio on impeachment coming up at tomorrows earrings. Guest the chairman of the committee, jerry nadler, argued in private to speak and speaker nancy pelosi, that he believes an impeachment inquiry is warranted right now. He has not said that publicly, because he wants to stay in the good graces of the speaker and they dont want to bounce off of each other in that respect. One thing nadler has been mentioning is the idea that the office of Legal Counsel opinion about not indicting a sitting president essentially means youre putting the president above the law because you say the president could commit crimes, not to be indicted or charged with a criminal or a crime rather, but when Congress Tries to investigate, you are not allowing congress to do its work to hold the president accountable outside of the criminal justice system. The one way to hold him accountable outside of the system is impeachment. That is the argument nadler has been making publicly, but in private, he is gone further to Speaker Pelosi saying he things its time to start an inquiry. After tomorrow, we will know more about what the dynamics are on impeachment. I have a feeling more democrats will come out in favor of impeachment. It is below 50 . If it goes above 50 , that doesnt necessarily put any pressure on Speaker Pelosi. She believes not only is impeachment bad for the country and to divisive, but she believes it could hand the president a political gift ahead of his reelection. We already see him touting the results of last weeks impeachment voting, where only 95 members of the house, all democrats, voted against tabling al greens impeachment resolution. He is already trying to say they are exonerating and quitting me acquitting me. That is what Speaker Pelosi is worried about. Host bob out of daisy town, pennsylvania. Republican. Morning. Caller thank you for taking my call. My comment is, im sitting through the news channel and jerry nadler gave an interview. His questions were basically the three things they are looking one isimpeach president , having to have inclusion, and the third one that was interesting was they are stating a mock trial today and are going r questions and will have reading from the script. He wants to influence the american people. He said hes not looking for information, but rather to influence the american people, so if there is an impeachment, that there is in america. Could either of you clarify on the three things that congress is looking for to make this accessible on their part . Host im pretty sure we havent seen that interview, because we have been here at the top of the hour at 8 00 a. M. Morgan chalfant, perhaps you can talk to that . Guest we heard last week republicans were staging a mock hearing to go through their questions. Democrats are doing that today to prepare. I think one thing Many Democrats have said is that they dont necessarily expect the hearing tomorrow to yield new information. But, they say it could be productive because it will eliminate pieces of the report that the public doesnt know because it is such a large report and was released all at once. And, a lot of americans have not read it. I think that is where you get nadler and others saying we might not yield new information from mueller because he said he will stay within the confines of the report, but we will make sure the public is aware of x, y, and c in the report z in the report with respect to Michael Cohen, Paul Manafort, and i think you will see mueller being asked to restate portions of his report and go through analyst asians. Host the color brings of jerrold nadler, the chairman of the house Judiciary Committee, served 15 terms in congress and represents new yorks 10th district. He took over from a former congressman in november of 2017. He served 16 years in the new York State Assembly before congress. He has a law degree from fordham law. Hes the Ranking Member on the house Judiciary Committee. Georgesins represents ninth district republican, served three terms in the Georgia House of representatives, a former baptist pastor and practicing u. S. Air force reserve chaplain. His law degree comes from atlantas John Marshall law school. We will be hearing from them starting at 8 30 tomorrow and we will be there for it on cspan and cspan3. , asrage begins at 8 30 a. M. Well as cspan. Org. You can listen to it on the cspan radio app. Well is in cincinnati, ohio. A line for democrats. Go ahead, will. Caller i want to thank cspan. I dont know where i would be without cspan, but what i the report,y was the Mueller Report, first of all, i think mueller, when he wrote the letter to william barr , he expressed a lot of angst did inhat barr characterizing his report. He didntr know that cover the important points about the report, and i think that allows democrats to have an advantage going into the hearing. I think they will know what they already know, mueller has been disappointed on how barr has characterized his report. At two muellers credit, he requested to muellers credit, he requested the doj give him guidelines before the he goes into the hearing, which i thought was surprising, but to his credit, he did that. I think that bodes well for democrats. Host thanks for bringing that up. Andrew desiderio, rewind the tape on the interactions between mueller and barr at the end of his investigation. Guest what the caller was getting at was this idea that democrats will probably try to pit are against mueller pit barr against mueller. Dontd mueller said i feel like your summary after the full scope of our investigation and it wasnt until a month later, or a few weeks later after that that the full redacted version of the report came out. We know there is tension between mueller onbarr and the legal conclusions mueller led to. Barr stated a lot of that publicly. He said i didnt agree with a lot of the conclusions and mueller has not on so publicly. Democrats will try to make william barr the bogeyman, serving as the president s defense lawyer. They said he was trying to put up propaganda when he put out the four page summary which, in their view, didnt capture the full nature of the investigation. I dont think mueller will engage on that, because if we are saying as we are saying before, the clip we saw with bobby scott and rubber mueller, euler Robert Mueller, mueller refers to what the Justice Department guidelines are and what the Legal Framework is on this. He will say, look, nobody cares what i think. I know that is not true, but he will say it doesnt matter what i think, here is what is in the report. Democrats will try every which way to goad him into staying that stating that. Im doubtful Robert Mueller will engage in any meaningful, substance of way substantive way. Host im color, good morning. Caller caller, good morning. Caller the Mueller Report said there was no conclusion, and then the attorney general turned it over about the obstruction. Barr and rosenstein both read the report and came to the conclusion that there was no underlying obstruction. It should have ended it there, but the democrats will not let it go. I heard you mention the president s tax returns. Forirs is responsible everybodys tax returns, so why does a lot of the democrats and everybody want the president s tax returns . If there was anything in his tax returns that was a problem, the irs would have brought it up. Host that is kelly in west virginia. Morgan chalfant, focus on the word collusion and how Robert Mueller we define the term collusion, and how the public and media have used the term collusion. Guest i believe mueller would define it as a nebulous term that has no legal definition. He didnt evaluate collusion in his report. He focused on conspiracy, whether or not members or associates of the trunk campaign conspired with russia to interfere in the election. He didnt finds us find efficient sufficient evidence. The media has used collusion and so have members of congress. It is difficult because it muddies the water. There is a gap between what is collusion and what is conspiracy. Tomorrow, you will see mueller say conspiracy repeatedly and he will probably be asked if he evaluated collusion. He will say he didnt. The other thing i want to note, as i caller mentioned, he said mueller turned over the obstruction decision to bar. Barr, youdnt say, need to decide on obstruction because i couldnt. He left it out as an unanswered question. There was no direction from mueller to barr and the Justice Department to reach a conclusion on obstruction. Host the last call is mike, from wisconsin. Go ahead. Caller i would like to know more about hillary and her obstruction by destroying government property. A previous caller talked about that, but you guys never address that. Host Andrew Desiderio, how much will Hillary Clinton come up tomorrow. Guest i think the republican side of the committee will focus on a lot of issues. They will try to crossexamine Robert Mueller and get what the Ranking Member of the committee calls the other side of the report, the idea of how the phis applications came apart, which were used to get search warrants on the former campaign official. The second thing i think will be the way that rubber mueller team rubber muellers team was comprised. The president called them the 13 angry democrats. That is a reference to the fact that a lot of these prosecutors who were on rubber muellers team were people that had donated to democrats in the past. One of whom was at Hillary Clinton clintons Election Night party in 2016. Republicans are going to get at those issues to try to make the argument that millers team team there is an Ongoing Investigation into those very issues. I dont know when we are going to see the results of that. That is something that is already under investigation. A lot of republicans have said they want to learn more about that. We will learn more about it in the coming months but it is separate from the mother investigation. Morgan chalfant. Barr has initiated his own investigation into whether surveillance on the Trump Campaign was adequately predicated. Extra newgiven him authorities to conduct that investigation. That has just gotten underway. He has tapped the connecticut ag to undertake that. We will probably hear more about that in the coming months. Host Morgan Chalfant is National Security reported with the hill newspaper. Andrew desiderio a political washington journal continues. Schwartz joinss us now. He has written for the new yorker and New York Times magazine. Last year you worked on a profile of Robert Mueller for gq. When he breaks his silence again tomorrow and testifies before the house Judiciary Committee and then the house Intel Committee what are you expecting from him