Different way. That might increase smugglers and cartels who will say well take care of the situation for you and you pay us, is there a correlation there, is there not . I think its difficult to speculate. We have smuggling that occurs at our ports of entry. Across our southwest borders where migrants are presenting someone elses documents or hidden in vehicle. Its difficult for me to know. Senator peters is there anything being done to ensure that migrants waiting to go across are not being approached to use their services . Are either we or the Mexican Government engaged in attempting to disrupt that kind of business connection . Mr. Howe i dont have firsthand knowledge of that. The mexican authorities would have that responsibility. Senator peters would we want to know what the mexican authorities are doing and would we encourage them to do something . Mr. Howe absolutely. Senator peernts is it possible to get that information . Mr. Howe absolutely. Senator peters c. B. P. Said over 1,800 family units were interviewed who presented indications with fraud of 275 fraudulent families identified, based on the data that i have. Chief hastings, how many migrants crossed it during the time frame, roughly 200,000, is that accurate . Mid april to june 14, april, june, two months . Mr. Hastings we had a high volume, i think 132,000 last month. I can tell you for the year we had 5,100 fraudulent claims so far. Fraudulent family claims that we know of. Senator peernts what time frame . Mr. Hastings fiscal year. Senator peernts twomonth period . Mr. Hastings the chief testified last time. Its due to the volume that were seeing. Its very difficult to spend time interviewing and getting in depth with these individuals. Senator peters my question, also, how do you define a fraudulent family . Is a grandmother and a grandson considered a fraudulent family . Or is an aunt or nephew, is that adult sibling, minor sibling what is a fraudulent family . Mr. Hastings by definition its a parent or legal guardian or that one that is less than 18 years old. Senator peters parent or legal guardian. A grandmother bringing a grandson would be fraudulent family . Mr. Hastings its not necessarily counted as fraudulent. They are not a family unit. They will be in other words senator peters nonfamily unit coming across, a grandmother with her grandson or granddaughter would be considered a fraudulent family based on your definition . Mr. Hastings yes, sir. Senator peters could you give us indicators that would warrant you being a fraudulent family . Mr. Hastings the sheer reaction between the child and adult. The agents will see that and notice that and theyll start questioning further to try to determine if indeed it looks like its a true familiar relationship. We saw quite a bit of false documentation specifically from honduras and guatemala as well, birth certificates. Senator peters could you describe the way the c. B. P. Officers eye debit find the migrants that participated specifically in the d. N. A. Hy pilot double helix . These were not random sample of families, is that correct, these are folks that agents suspected as unlikely to be with a parent before you did the d. N. A. Testing . Mr. Nevano thank you. We sent it to mcallen. If they were individuals they had been suspected of being in a fraudulent family unit theyd refer it to the team that was down there to conduct the d. N. A. Testing. This was after interviews review of their documents and as my colleague stated, if the behavior did not appear in a familial relationship where there seems to be some distance between the they use those factors to refer that family unit over for a d. N. A. Test. Senator peernts one last question. Do you have an after action report you could share with congress to assess the viability of implementing d. N. A. Testing on a wider scale . Mr. Nevano senator, we did do an after action report. Well see about allowing you to see that report. Thank you. Senator peters i appreciate if you can get that to me. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Couple points. Those d. N. A. Tests are family u crossed between the ports of entry, 7 , 30,000 of those have come to the ports of entry. The vast volume really is coming in illegally between the ports of entry because thats the easier ticket in. Senator johnson i understand the point youre making. Its just so widely known the way to cross is coming across illegally because within six, seven, eight days youll be set free. Senator scott. Senator scott thank you, chief, for being here. Thank you for what youre doing. Im disgusted how congress has handled all this. You couldnt make this up. We dont want to secure a border. Then people want to complain youre not doing your job. I think its disgusting what people are doing. Mr. Hastings, what do you need congress to do to allow you to do the job you were actually hired to do rather than the job youre having to do today because congress has not acted . Mr. Hastings thank you for the question, sir. As i said in my opening, i mean, first and foremost short term, we need additional funding for the supplemental as do our partners. Because as i mentioned again, the volume of what we have in our custody right now, that 13,000 is primarily unaccompanied alien children, approximately 1,000 today, and then in addition to that, its single Adult Children single adults, rather, that we have in custody as well. So h. H. S. Need funding for bed space to get those out of Border Patrol custody and into the care of those who are set up for longterm detention. Thats short term. Long term, we need to fix the quit allowing this draw for family units and unaccompanied alien children to come to the United States. E have to stop this. Senator scott mr. Howe. The owe to underscore i. C. E. To get the bed space and h. H. S. So they can relieve our facilities that werent designed for longterm detention so we are not in the situation. Senator scott do either of you believe we need to have more Border Protection . So far, talk about supplemental and the decision primarily, so what about do we need any funding to secure the border . This wouldnt be happening if we had a secured border. Mr. Nevano we need funding for Border Security. Its pulling 40 to 60 agents to deal with the humanitarian crisis, the family, and the u. A. C. s. Thats the biggest problem we ave right now. Mr. Hastings a large number of single adults are still trying to evade arrest to your point. A large dynamic of drugs as well. Trying to evade. And theyre using these family units who are trying to cross as a diverseary tactic in many cases to be able to make money on drugs and single adults trying to evade arrest. Senator scott would you like to add anything . Mr. Nevano thank you. We are the investigative part of humanitarian. The resources we take away from targeting the Transnational Criminal Organizations that are actually organizing these smuggling loads and human trafficking, by putting people on the border to augment the need that c. B. P. Has takes away potentially from conducting our mission which is, you know, protecting of the homeland via investigations and try to target these Transnational Criminal Organizations. Senator scott mr. Hastings, how does it make you feel when you get asked questions to suggest you dont you or your team doesnt care about these children that youre taking care of, how do yall feel every day when you get up and read the paper or see the news and see someone suggests that you arent doing your job . Mr. Hastings its hurtful because daily i see our agents doing the opposite. Yesterday, i saw our agents jump out of the water, save a 13yearold child who was unconscious, give him c. P. R. , give him mouthtomouth and essentially bring him back to life. That happened yesterday on our border. That happens quite often, time and time again. Our men and women are out there risking their lives every day to save those migrants that are put into a bad position by smugglers or put themselves into bad position. Above and beyond that, our agents go to the maximum to care for these children. Youve seen pictures as well of our agents holding these children, trying to comfort them. So its very hurtful for us, for our agents who are out there trying to do the best they can at securing our border and dealing with this humanitarian crisis. Senator scott how has it impacted your ability to recruit and retain your team to do this job . Mr. Hastings so our workforce is doing well right now, but they want to see a light at the end of the tunnel, quite frankly, to be able to go back to their primary National Security mission. And thats what were hopeful for, that we go back to a primary National Security mission and we see legislative changes that ayou lao us to do that. Quit the draw for the family units and the unaccompanied alien children. Senator scott so do you have concerns when you do your job every day that because of how much time youre having to spend because Congress Wont act that we have individuals that are crossing the border that want to harm americans . Mr. Hastings im concerned with that. Im concerned with recruiting individuals in had this current state that were in right now, recruiting good agents to do this in the future. And im worried when were diverted by the humanitarian crisis what is coming through our border. The best example i could give is about two months ago we had a large group come across in rio grande valley. This is broad daylight at the same time we had 790 pounds of cocaine a mile away cross the border in broad daylight. That tells me that theres very little fear in the minds of the smuggling organizations and narcotics traffickers because they know were tied up with other things, humanitarian mission. Senator scott anybody else . Mr. Nevano i am used to this via my career. Can you imagine a new agent that just come on, that went out and had a successful day, they seize enough fentanyl that could kill hundreds and millions of people or they arrested a potential terrorist suspect or gang member or they rescued a child from exploitation and they go home and turn on the nightly news and theres information on the news saying abolish certain agencies, can you imagine how that agent feels . I know personally when i come home i dont even want to watch that because its hurtful, as my colleagues stated. Its very hurtful and the men and women of i. C. E. , e. R. O. , are out there every day trying to make this country safe. Mr. Howe itsonunnecessary distraction. Our agents want to be mission focused. They want to do what they were hired to do, enforcing our laws and facilitating trade and travel. We dont want to be distracted processing migrants to the numbers we are. Senator scott im disgusted we sit here and you watch on the news where people are trying to do their job and congress sits here and doesnt do their job. Its the most disgusting thing ive ever seen in my entire career, my business career. You wouldnt do this in your business career. Thank you. Senator johnson senator holly. Senator holly thank you. Can i disagree what senator scott just said . The behavior of this congress is absolutely pathetic. Its just pathetic. People up here should be apologizing to you for the total dir election of duty that this congress has undertaken. I have never seen anything like it in my life. This is by my count the sixth hearing, full hearing i sat through in four months on the border which is great. Im glad were paying some attention to it. The problem is this congress doesnt do anything. This congress refuses to do anything. We know what the facts are. Youve outlined them again today. C. B. P. Is overcapacity, underfunded, undermanned. I. C. E. Overcapacity, underfinded. H. H. S. , overcapacity, underfunded. Yet, this congress will do nothing. Senator hawley what are the cartels doing . Lying to families, exploiting children, in order to turn profits and break our asylum system. We know we need to reform the asylum system. We need to address the push factors. We know that but this Congress Wont do anything. This morning i heard just from my colleagues across the aisle this morning, i heard statements, im heart broken. No one is more vulnerable than a child. The status quo is unacceptable, unsustainable, but yet we dont do anything to change it. Theres no will to change it. Children are being exploited. This morning we woke up to the picture of the man from el salvador and his young daughter dead, faced down in the water. Why . Because they were exploited. Who knows how much that poor gentleman paid to some smuggling ring who told him if he came to the United States to our border and claimed asylum hed automatically get in. Thats a lie. Who knows what lies he was told. Here he ends up he and his little baby dead and this Congress Still refuses tookt. I mean, it is absolutely unconscionable. We know what needs to be done. Nobody will do it. My view is, we can talk and talk and talk, but until this congress is willing to take some action, i mean, im sorry for what it is you have to deal with. I am sorry this congress has left you without the resources you need. Im sorry this congress has not done its duty. Im sorry that this congress has left, not only our southern border expos and vulnerable but has left children exploited day after day after day, and until this rechted congress does something i dont know why we retched congress does something i dont know why we have these hearings. This congress refused to act. So thank you, gentlemen, for your service. Thank you for what youre doing. And i just say to the president , i encourage the president to take every action he possibly can within the bounds of the law to address the crisis and secure the border because its clear to me this congress will not act in any meaningful way. So long as this congress refuses to act this president needs to act. So i would urge him and the administration to do everything within their Lawful Authority to address this crisis because this congress is not going to. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator johnson senator hawley, you missed the opening. When i described a process this community is going to undertake. Obviously the reason we hold these hearings is in the problem solving process to lay out the reality. So what i propose, talking to senator peters, and hopefully we can do this in as nonpartisan and uninflamed way as possible, but sit down at those tables like we did last week where we passed the end Government Shutdown act, a smaller problem but one i think our legislation solves, senator lankfords legislation, senator hassans legislation but start working through this problem in a very organized fashion. Have open meetings where we discuss these things. And we talk about, ok, what what do we need to do . Coming from a manufacturing background. What do we need to start the process . Senator peters is working with me, other on the letter of Operation Safe return, a Pilot Program where we can surge resources to i am not going to repeat it. Were working on that. But im hoping that youll participate, hope every member will participate in this process a number of meetings, hours long where we thoroughly discuss these problems, the different elements of the problem and start coming up with solutions. Again, i dont know that ends up in a complete piece of legislation or in those discussions in an organized fashion we come up with different elements that can be tacked on to pieces of legislation. This place doesnt work. It does not have much of a problem solving capacity. Thats the frustration, senator scott, that you are certainly relaying. We all experience. We are going to do something different. Do something paradigm shifting. Again, whether we accomplish something or not, at least weve had very hopefully thorough discussion. Senator scott. Senator scott i dont believe any of it. I sit here, preside this week. I hear people from democrats get up here and all they do is complain about these people. They dont come up and say we need to fix the decision. They dont come up and say we need to fix this. Its disgusting. I watched it yesterday presiding somebody did it for 15 minutes. Sit there and lambaste them what theyre doing. Mr. Hastings, have you how many people have you ever worked with that said, i dont care about children . I want to do the wrong thing today . Mr. Hastings just the opposite. I have seen agents on their own go out and purchase toys, bring in for the children to play with. I have personally stopped by and bought meals for those i have arrested. Ive seen agents do the same thing. Ive seen agents give up their lunches. Ive seen the humane professionalism and outstanding work by our agents since ive been in this agency and long before that. Senator johnson so, senator scott senator scott the people are going to the homestead facility to make news. They dont appear to solve a problem. They say, how do i make news . Senator johnson i fully understand it. I am frustrated with you with the process. Im hoping this committee will be different, this process will be different. Engage in it. Lets give everybody a chance. Pardon. Indiscernible] senator johnson lets get it on the table like we did last week and lets see what we can make of it. Again, you have to be tenacious. We have to start moving the football forward or we throw up our hands and say well never fix that problem. That photograph ought to catalyze this. Senator lankford. Senator lankford i want to join my colleagues in the frustration of this day and i think what were experiencing today is some pent up abject total frustration. March 28 of this year, at that time secretary of d. H. S. Came to this hearing and followed up with a letter, and this was the exact quote from her, we now face a systemwide meltdown. D. H. S. Facilities are overflowing, agents and officers are stretched too thin, and the magnitude of arriving and detained aliens have increased the risk of lifethreatening dints. Then she said, my greaten concern is for the children who have been my greatest concern is for the children who have been arriving sicker than ever before after arriving from the treacherous trek. Instead of providing funding during this time period, this congress delayed. And didnt provide the funding, didnt engage, didnt try to solve it. That same secretary over and over and over again said none of this gets better until the flores agreement is settled. I had personal conversations with democratic and republican members on this committee and say, what point do we finally admit that the Obama Administration made that the trump Administration Made that if we dont resolve the flores settlement none of this ever gets better because traffickers will continue to move children across our border . Children are currently being used as pawns on the border to try to hurt the Trump Administration. My democratic colleagues are trying to identify children that are not getting care at the same time slowing down the process of getting humanitarian aid to try to hurt this president ial election. These kids are not pawns and the administration has said month after month after month we need additional humanitarian assistance. But heres whats happened. Nothing happened after that meeting in march. May 1, h. H. S. Sent us a protracted letter to try to get additional assistance and saying we are at a crisis moment. May 17 they contacted us again and said we are at a critical moment. Senator azar from h. H. S. Secretary azar from h. H. S. Said we are at a critical moment. We tried to move a humanitarian relief package with the Disaster Relief package on may 22, and leader schumer came to the floor and made this statement. That democrats are ready to pass the bipartisan Disaster Relief package thats already been agreed to and written but we should pass disaster agreement as is and return to unrelated issues at a later date. Unrelated issues is this humanitarian issue. To say these unrelated issues are slowing down our Disaster Work so well put the humanitarian work off until later. And then yesterday, senator schumer was back on the floor criticizing the president and criticizing all of these folks and their agencies saying, why arent you taking better care of the kids . When this committee has talked about it for months, yall have asked for it for months, and all weve got to is well get to unrelated issues later. Now, im tired of people calling my office and saying, how come you dont care about the kids . Im sure youre tired of reading in the media every day, how come you dont care about the kids . If 500 people showed up at your house tomorrow and said, im going to stay here for a week, would your house be ready to take 500 people . What would you do if 500 people came to your house tomorrow and said i need to stay here . Yall are having to manage thousands of people showing up at facilities that are not prepared for thousands of people, that never have been, and not set up for kids and the whole time we argue, what are we going to do, when everyone knows the issue. Its the flores settlement. Every smuggler uses that, and we wont acknowledge it and theres been a dramatic slowdown on trying to actually get humanitarian aid. Now the senate comes to an agreement, finally on a humanitarian aid, and the house responds with a solely partisan bill and says, no, were going to try to do a partisan bill and then the conversation this week was, well, we may not get to the humanitarian bill this week if we dont get a certain vote we want on the ndaa. As democrats, we may hold off the humanitarian bill in ndaa for two weeks from now. Yet, another delay because its an unrelated bill. So i dont know if we get the humanitarian vote, again, this week because democratic leadership is postponing again while going to the floor and saying, why isnt the Trump Administration doing more about this . You cant have it both ways. This is not about hurting the president and his president ial election hopes for next year. This is about a group of kids that we need to reduce the incentive for them to be able to come illegally across our border and we need to take care of the folks that are already here. This is not that hard. But its become this horrible partisan issue. I think all of us are really frustrated with. To say this has been discussed to death. We got to be able to act on this. So i want to ask just a couple stats. How many folks are coming across as males at this point and claiming to be 17 years old . Is there a disproportionate amount of males crossing the border and saying im 17 . Sir, i dont have the exact numbers but i can tell you ere seeing a higher number of families as fathers theyre the primary parent thats coming across. Were seeing an increase of fathers with children. I dont have the exact numbers with me. Senator lankford how many countries have you seen crossing our border with minors . Mr. Hastings 140 apprehensions from 140 countries. 52 countries for family units. So we have family units from 52 Different Countries that have crossed into the u. S. This fiscal year. Senator lankford and thats just this fiscal year . So that would be since october 1, last year . Mr. Hastings thats correct, sir. Senator lankford theyre coming from countries other than mexico at this point, is that correct . Mr. Hastings thats correct, sir. Senator lanksford guatemalan authorities i met with senator lankford guatemalan authorities i met with said they are continuing to work because the guatemalan authorities dont want those kids also making this trek and they are trying to do what they can to slow down the flow from their side as well and they were very appreciative of the work d. H. S. Has done to be able to partner with guatemala, specifically. Now, im sure if i talked to hor doran authorities and El Salvadoran authorities they would say the same. The gat mallan authorities were the guatemalan authorities were grateful to our government to not only protect those kids but quite frankly, they want their kids back home to be able to be and they are frustrated by this whole journey as well. As a country, we have put hundreds of millions of dollars into Central America, into the northern triangle for quite a while to stabilize those governments and to be able to do that, to be able to provide a safe place thats there. So all this conversation about were doing nothing to be able to help the issues there really is, we are doing a lot of things to be able to help the issues in Central America. Whats not being done is deal with the pull factors here in the flores settlement and frustratingly enough, also the humanitarian assistance. Crisis. Its also a drug crisis impacting my home state of ohio and a every state represented in this dais. Crystal meth is coming in in unpress tented numbers, as a an example. We knew the heroin was coming in. Crystal meth coming in entirely from the Mexican Border now, we are told. Its also a humanitarian crisis, no question. The men and women who you represent are being put in an impossible position. I hope that every member of this body protects the rate of american Law Enforcement to do their job. Its a tough job. I think you are doing it in a professional way, and i know its difficult. I guess what i would like to focus on is solutions. I do think there are some potentially Bipartisan Solutions and i want to hear from you on it. One, that has always struck me as a reasonable approach we should be taking, which was done during the Obama Administration, is to have people apply p from their home country. They would apply technically as refugees from their home country because you claim asylum when you come into the United States. The criteria are the same. The criteria that have to be met are the same that are eventually add qudated over adjudicated over here. We find 15 that apply receive asylum. That number may not be entirely ack a contract going forward. The point is most people who are applying are not receiving it because they are deemed through our judicial system are being deemed economic refugees and not meeting the criteria. What if we set up a system, as was done, again, in the Obama Administration, where people instead of being told by the traffickers you got to come on this arduous journey, we are going to mortgage your house for you, and we are going to take your paycheck for the next half year and we are going to take your kids because if you are a a kid under the flores decision then you cant be held in detention for more than 20 days, instead, the traffickers had to say you have to apply here. You have to apply from home country. Two things would have to happen. One, we would have to raise the cap on refugees, which has been lowered during this administration. That should be acknowledged. It would require specifically a cap to be raised for Central American countries. Second, we have to provide the resources. As you know, with refugee resettlement, thats done through and including the u. N. , refugee settlement operations. This could be can internationalized. I have talked to a number of my colleagues on the democratic side of the aisle about this. They havent said no. It certainly makes sense as part of an overall strategy in my view. The pull factor is the fact you can can midst use our asylum system. Can you can get a job here in america and make 10 to 20 times more than your home country. If i was in that situation or you, you would be tempted to do the same thing. Doesnt make it right. One way to do this is to have people instead of being told you have to make this journey up north, you have to apply right here. Lets adjudicate these cases, use the United Nations and other international bodies. That reduces the flow in a substantial way. I just wondered if any of you, assistant director knee varo in varo, mr. Hastings, mr. Howe, if you had any thoughts of going back to this system of people applying from their home country. Thank you for your question. Im not as versed in that area, but the argument that you make seems to make sense. I am familiar back in my younger career i actually did process refugees. A lot of vietnamese, russians back in the early 1990s, it was an effective system that worked. Mr. Nevano i can see the merits of that system and look forward to working with congress and our partners if thats something that is decided to try that out and see if its something that can help stop this crisis. Mr. Portman i know you are familiar with this, but the criteria you use to determine whether somebody was eligible for Refugee Status, was the same as the aasylum status. Mr. Nevano i believe its section 207 of the i. N. A. And section 208 of the i. N. A. Is a difference. Whether they apply here in the United States or outside the United States. Mr. Portman there is also a a requirement should somebody receive Refugee Status there is assistance provided, usually through a private sector entity. Refugee resettlement, we are familiar with. Its a a different process. It keeps people from come canning up to this border. It keeps the from coming up to this border. It keeps numbers we see here, hundreds of thousands of months from coming to our border. If you want to apply for this status you have to do it back home. Mr. Howe, mr. Hastings . I think its probably common sense. It reduces the pull factors. Well let the lawyers work out the details. If it can be done, if its been done before, working with the state department, our international partners, it makes sense. Mr. Portman mr. Hastings. Mr. Hastings i would welcome anything that allows our Border Patrol agents to get back to the pry marerry mission of securing our borders and ruses the flow. Mr. Portman your testimony earlier was striking to me when you talked about 40 to 60 of their people have been pulled off the jobs to deal with the humanitarian crisis. I understand why they are doing it, and they have to. We want to be sure we are providing Emergency Care that so many of these migrants need. Thats not their job. That leads me to my final question which is about the drug issue. When the Border Patrols a not on the border trying to detect and stop these Illegal Drugs from coming into our country, that are killing people i represent, that creates a whole otherer crisis. Its not on the border. Its in ohio. Its in every state represented on this dais. People, mr. In varo, you can can talk about these transnational trafficking groups that are smuggling people, but also smuggling drugs at the same time. What can we do better to be able to detect and stop this poison from coming into our country . Crystal meth back in the day we had meth labs in our states. People made meth in their basements or homes. Environmental problems with that in addition to this poison being made that was harming our communities. You dont see that anymore, why . Because the crystal meth from mexico, pure, is so cheap and powerful im told by Law Enforcement in columbus, ohio, its less expensive than buying mare juan aa on the streets now and its killing people. N varo, what can we do mr. Nevaro, what can we do to stop these drugs . Mr. Nevano i had the opportunity to testify before your committee before about the opioid addiction in the United States. I know you were very well awarer that we initiated a Border Enforcement Security Team in the state of howe. I know you were present for. Thats a recent occurrence we are trying to stop the opioid flow into the state of ohio. Our Border Enforcement Security Teams, we have 65 across the country, those peoples are crucial because it takes resource from state, local, and a federal authorities to attack a problem. The more Border Enforcement Security Teams we have to tackle the drug problem, i think the better we can identify it. Also, too, continue our Capacity Building overseas. We have trained what we call transnational criminal investigative units. We have 16 of those stationed across the country and the world. Those individuals are dedicated and our eyes and ears overseas to help provide us the intelligence, information, and execute the laws that we dont have the authority to do so in the Central America area, mexico, and the drug producing countries. We rely very heavily on our trained partners and transnational criminal investigative units. Mr. Portman thank you, mr. Chairman. Senator carper. Senator carper thanks very much. Normally we ask questions of our witnesses. Im going to use this as a chance to have a colloquy with two of my colleagues who i have a lot of high regard and affection for. I might ask you a question but may not. It seems peculiar to me as i was putting together a congressional dell gration earlier this year, we looked at the flow of folks coming herer from mexico over the last 15, 20 years as you know there are more mexicans going back into mexico these days than there are mexicans coming into the u. S. We looked at some getting ready, we looked how ilLegal Immigration numbers through the end of last october. This is about maybe the very beginning. We looked at a immigration numbers through the end of october and my recollection was the previous 15 years our Legal Immigration from illegal mmigration had dropped by ilLegal Immigration across our southern border over the past 15 years through the end of october, it was down by a little over 80 . I was almost ready to declare victory. In the months since then, about six months since then, we have seen this surge, incredible surge of ilLegal Immigration from honduras, guatemala, and salvador. Whats happened with with mexico . The same. Its been pretty much what its been for years. They are not surging from mexico. They are still, im told, morer mexicans going back to mexico than mexican americans coming to the u. S. Why is it these three countries we have not seen this kind of surge from mexico . They have poverty there, crime there, so forth. And the there is a a great need for leadership on this issue. I think it has to come from this committee. I heard the gentleman say any number of times this committee has a great record of history of bipartisanship. Frankly i think this committee aa tracts people who like to get things done attracts people who like to get things done, work across the aisle, and build consensus. We really see an opportunity here. Very sad situation. We also see an opportunity to fix it. I would like for us to be the committee that provides that kind of leadership. Im not interested in pointing blame. I could easily say in response to some of my colleagues this administration, points out all their sins. Im not going to o do that. Lets see what we can do to fix this problem. I want to sign up to do that. I look at the four of us, if we cant work this out, nobody can. This is just ripe for our working on it. Do you have anything else you want to say with that spirit that i have just tried to kindle here . Anything you want to say in response to that . First of all a thank you for what you do. When i was chairman of this committee i used to go to the floor every month and talk about different units of the department of Homeland Security and praise the men and women who worked there. We are just out there, chairman and i went out there for the opening of the new department of Homeland Security in st. Elizabeth, very exciting day. In the spirit of what i have just said, id like for you guys to say something. Thank you, senator, for what you have said. And your commitment to Work Together to work out legislation or whatever needs to be done to stop the crisis. The men and women on the border work hard, proud of what they do. Lets mission focus them on what they need to do. Mr. Carper anything else . Appreciate it. Mr. Hastings for the men and women of the Border Patrol we ask for to work on the legislative fixes to allow them to get back to doing their primary mission. Carper mr. In varo mr. Nevaro whatever you can to to help us out. We want to vow focus on the large criminal networks actually exploiting these individuals. Mr. Nevano whatever you can do to make us get back to doing that time of work and less dealing with the border crisis. We appreciate it. Thank you very much. Mr. The chair recognizes the gentleman fromer as i have oftentimes said in this room that we have to focus on root causes. Its the pull factors or push factors, but some of the situations we have seen in visits down to guatemala and salvador, if we were living dn kids and a families out of there, too. Somehow its gotten easier. Its gotten easier. People usually have to walk 1,500 miles in all kinds of bad weather and danger. They still do it. Now they can get in a bus. And come on up in an air conditioned bus and be dropped off at the border. A a lot of people are doing it. The coyotes, folks running these operation, they are very entrepreneurial. They can kind all kinds of ways to make money including the bus service business. We have to be smart enough to figure out how to shut that down. We cant to it by ourselves. The mexicans, if we are ever going to get this usmca, im not saying that should be a condition they work with us to shut town those buses, that would be part. There are all kinds of things. The other thing we have been working for about three years on alliance for prosperity, as you know. Its not the whole answer. Its part of the answer. There is no silver bullet, a lot of silver bbs, some bigger than others. One of the bigger ones is making sure would he address the root causes of why people are trying to get up here. Lack of opportunity and hope. Crime and violence, scruppings. What we are trying to do with the alliance for prosperity is address all three. Sadly, when we look at the supplemental thats the president s cut off that funding to the a alliance for prosperity. When we look at the legislation supplemental forer folks on the border, we dont restore it, which i think is a mayes take. We have to be able to walk and chew gum at the same time. We have to address the root causes and the pull factors as well. I sign up for doing that. I suspect my colleagues to the left would do so as well. Thank you. Senator carper, will he me say i appreciate your willing to participate in this process t will take advantage of, i think, the nonpartisan attitude by so many members of this committee. Mr. Johnson senator johnson we have gathered information, trying to find the root cause of this problem. I continue to say the primary root causes is americas insatiable appetite for drugs. Having been a manufacturer, solved a lot of problems, there is a a process you go through. Thats what i want to see this committee engaged in. Not here at the dais but down there with genuine conversations, do it in an organized process, trying to address all the complexities of this. But also trying to find priorities. What are the things we have to fix now . In the here and now. What are the longer Term Solutions as well . Im dedicated to doing this. Its going to be a a completely different process than this senates been participating in as long as i have been a senator. Its going to be genuine conversation, going to be, i think, senators with good will recognize the problem and a working toward real solutions. I appreciate that. All you have to do is show up. Well be holding multiple hearings meetings and they will go on for quite some time. Im just you know how tenacious i am. With that, senator sinema. Senator sinema our nation face as crisis. Im committed to continuing our work, stop the flow of migrants, and assure fair and humane treatment of thumb. Our communities, n. G. O. s is not sustainable. I want it make sure we are working together to develop bipartisan and commonsense solutions. These solutions have to include measures that push back against the human traffickers and the criminal organizations who prey on migrants. Im pleased we are having this hearing and i look forward to our discussion. My first question today is for mr. In varo mr. Nevaro. Over 590,000 migrants have crossed our border this fiscal year. All along the journey miants are targeted by criminal elements, newman traffickers, smugglers who transfor the for a fee, and other criminals. The moi grants coming to our borderer approximately the migrants coming to our border, how many had have some interaction with a krill nam element, and how many of those migrantsciesance on their ourney from smugglers . Mr. Nevaro im not sure anyone can give the exact numbers as far as the estimates you are asking for. However, i would say to make that 1,500 mile journey its very difficult to to that on your own. These smuggling organizations are recruiting these individuals, making false promises to them about getting into the United States, making a better life, promising them lucrative jobs when they get here. Once they get here the traffickers take over and put them in totally different circumstances. I will say in order to make that journey very High Percentage of these individuals are seeking assistance paying upwards of 7,000 to 8,000 to make it to the border, thinking they are coming for a better life only to be exploited once they pass the border whether between ports of entry or port of entry. Enator sinema mr. In vano, mr. Nevano o, do you have any information on how linked they are to transnational organizations to transport people across the border . Mr. Nevano what we term illicit pathways, they are controlled by the cartels. They are used to bring narcotics through those pathways and people. The smugglers, transnational organizations, criminal organizations dont care what the product is. Whether its a commodity, person. They use the same pathways. The human smugglers may have to pay a fee to the cartels to use those pathways. But there is a direct correlation between the pathways used for smuggling narcotics as there is for smuggling persons. Senator sinema my next question is for all of the panel. I welcome all your thoughts. Its clear to me and many arizonans that our nation faces a direct threat from these smuggling operations. Of course they are taking advantage of people in Central America. Id like to hear more about what our National Strategy is to defeat this threat and what are some of the steps that your agencies are taking to counteract these criminal transnational organizations . I will say its very hard to devil into interview and follow delve into interview and follow through with the proper intelligence. Mr. Hastings we are trying to get the through put. We are overwhelmed by the mass amount of families that are coming into our facilities, its very difficult to take the time to delve into a smuggling case. We try the best of our ability, we also are trying to balance that with the humanitarian crisis that we currently have. Its very difficult. Thats why we would again ask for the legislative changes that stop this draw so we can go back and focus on the smuggling, focus on the trafficking, focus on the d. T. O. s bringing thousands of pounds of narcotics into our country through the ports of entry and in between the ports of entry. Mr. Howe similar to chief hastings, we are in the interdiction phase. We are identifying the smuggling attempt and stopping it. I mentioned earlier on average about 400 crime prosecutions on the southwest border for people trying to be smuggled into the United States. We are on that front end of it. The back end, investigation really is through our i. C. E. Partners. To get into the details of the d. T. O. s. Mr. Nevano the paradigm of effective Border Security starts 12,3500 miles out with Capacity Building and Training Foreign Police Officers to interdict, train them, provide them the equipment. Thats something that Homeland Security is doing. To attack the problem foreign. We know it doesnt always work. Our brothers and sisters at customs and Border Protection are the interdicters. There is a Border Security at our borders. But interior enforcement is equally as part of that threeprong approach to the paradigm of borderer security. Work site enforcement bleeds several other collateral crimes. These individuals once they get here they know they are promised a job. Thats where the human trafficking, flawedent documents, identity benefit fraud, thats where all that a happens. The false promise of a a job. So it has to be a threefrong approach to effective Border Security. Senator sinema quick followup question. Directl hastings you mentioned changing american lives, which i think we could all agree is difficult in our current Political Climate. What im looking for and im a grateful to be working with the chairman and others on this, ways to help the administration improve the credible fear process. Thats something we are working on to try to figure out how we can do that given the difficult partisan Political Climate we are living in. Im also interested in figuring out how do we disrupt these Smuggling Networks so they no longer see a a financial benefit. I dont see this as a Smart Business plan to bring groups to the United States and try to xploit the socalled loophole. Mr. Hastings what we hear in the field and i said this earlier, from those we interview, time and time again, what we are told is from social media or from a Family Member here or from a friend here i have heard bring a child and ill be released within 10, 20 days. Until there is something that can can a address that flow, allow to us keep that family unit together, and allow us to run them through the proper cycle to allow them to have their due process and rights, and then return them if there is no credible fear and apply a consequence. If we are not applying a consequence we are going to continue to see this issue. Senator sinema thats the exact issue we are working on to try to figure out how do we get folks and a families, talking about legitimate families not the illegitimate ones we see, how do we help process families in a timely manner to address the issue while also sending a clear message back to those northern countries that this is not an effective strategy to get into the United States of america. Its going to be difficult, i understand, but that is something we are very interested in doing is figuring out how do we help process families and folks faster to actually get folks back home if they dont qualify for asylum or for some other legal status of entry to our country. Mr. Chairman, i see my time has expired. Chairman johnson thank you for cooperating with mow and my staff and senator peters, hopefully we can can get that letter of support and d. H. S. Can implement that. Its a first step to provide that consequence. With real care a and compassion. Thank you for your efforts there. I want to thank the witnesses for just your service to this country. Chief hastings, thank you for providing that example of Border Patrol officer pulling somebody out of the river, applying c. P. R. , saving their life. Thats a an example of, im sure, thousands of examples of compassion, the type of care that the Border Patrol, i. C. E. , d. H. S. Provides people. This is we saw passion today at the hearing. Thats good. It shows the members of this committee are deeply concerned and want to get to a solution. Without what will be my job is turn that passion into commitment to actually act. Again i want to thank all of you for your service. I want to thank senator sinema, my colleagues on the committee. My commitment, well Start Holding these meetings where well have a genuine and robust discussion in that problem solving process. It will result in good ideas, areas of agreement, and possibly a full piece of legislation, if not elements, components that can be added to other legislation that other committees may take up as well. This committee has led on this issue. I dont think committee has held more hearings, gathered more information, sought to understand this problem more than this committee has over the last 4 1 2 years. Now its time to turn that into action. I think we have the members of this committee, senator sinemas one of them, that will come to that table right here in this committee room, probably starting the week after we return, and have those robust discussions to come to some agreement and start solving this problem. Again, thank youall. The hearing record will remain open for 15 days until july 11 at 5 00 p. M. For submission of statements and questions for the record. This hearing is adjourned. [captions Copyright National able satellite corp. 2019] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] we join this Senate Hearing in progress. You can can can find it all online at cspan. Org. Search smuggling. The u. S. House will meet at noon eastern, about a halfhour from now to resume debate on 47 billion next year for the Treasury Department and assorted general government branches, including the white house and judiciary. Members are working their way through amendments, expect a final vote this afternoon about 3 00 eastern. Well have live coverage here on cspan. Its expected to be a relatively early day at work today as members of both sides ofcially Donald Trumps campaign, with black lives matter, and the police shootings, and tragic events all in baton rouge and dallas. It was reaeally a time when peoe felt like all they were seeing on tv about race was bad news. And here was first a white man add a mitting that he was prejudice. Which for people of color was, you know, we kind of just all said, finally. Sunday night at a 8 00 eastern on cspans q a. Q a. Ost our guest is ben cline we will talk more about border and immigration, but other is issues related to your areas of rk
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