Regarding our friend david im going to do that right away. Id actually come up to me and ive spoken to Allen Weisselberg about how to set the whole thing up with the funding yes and its all the stuffing all the stuff because here you have an or with that company you have an over his going but correct. So im im all over that and i spoke to alan about it when it comes time for the financing, which will be what will have to so get hold on and on and on. I got no check back with the panel joining us. Cnns laura coates, host of Laura Coates Live at 11. Also cnns kara scannell, who was in court again today. What did what stood out to you care from court today . I mean, i think the audio is a big thing. Were hearing Donald Trumps voice, the jury is hearing that for the first time and hearing a lot of Michael Cohen lets conversations because that was just one of the Audio Recordings that was played today. The other one that was played was cohen on the phone with davidson. Were counting a conversation with donald trump in which he was saying that he was quoting trump is saying, i hate the fact that we did it referring to the Stormy Daniels deals. So just interesting for the jury to hear this, these are realtime recordings. Of course, trumps lawyers will push back on what it means and what he was referring to. But just really the jury hearing, both cohen referencing trump and donald trump, whos sitting in the room, but hearing him on this secretly recorded phone conversation, talking about this specific deal in the cases trumps lawyers have tried to push away from it, youre laura, how do you think these recordings play . Well, they are part of the overall jigsaw puzzle. You want to give a little bit for each witness. Now, one witness is not gonna give you everything you ever need to prove your case, but you want to get the juror closer and closer to the clear picture. But you also want them thinking themselves as shady as it might be for an attorney to record a comes with his client why did you think you had to what took place before that and what took place after that to put in context exactly why you were doing that. Thatll give some additional food for thought for the jurors to understand. Is he doing it to save his skin or is he doing it because he believes that this person is somehow trying to be secretive about even his involvement in it. And hes trying in to give some evidence down the road. Thats part of the overall picture is becoming increasingly clear that Michael Cohen is not going to be the most sympathetic figure for these jurors, nor does he have to be. Where does david pecker have to be naught is the idea of the catch and kill and salacious details. They have to return the jury to the overarching crime that they are alleging the falsified Business Records. A lot they this is about contextualizing it. And the audio is why they dont help necessarily in terms of showing cohen as somebody who should be completely trusted. It doesnt absolve trump of being open, being skeptical about why someone did not trust him. When do you think Michael Cohen will be brought to the stand . Even Michael Cohen doesnt know. I mean, its essentially basically they tell them to be in the area at a certain time and then but youve seen how the prosecution has been laying out the witnesses. They have someone really interesting like david pecker, come on the first day and then theyll bring in the people who are going to do basically custodial records because as you noted in a an 8 00 hour, trumps team wont stipulate to anything. They wont say yes, our client did say that at a trump rally and 28 so they have to bring in people. Just say this, the chain of evidence to bring in someone today to say yes, this audio is real, it is verified. Weve been able to authenticate it. And so i think thats one thing when we talk about whether a witness is believable or not or credible or not. And Michael Cohen obviously is going to get a very tough crossexamination. We know that the audio tape brings trump closer to this, and its irrefutable. It is trumps voice on there. It is trump talking about it. Can we just talk a little bit about the tape because i am sure the juror to hear that lets start at the the tape they are going to hear it multiple, multiple times and im sure parsing every word. But what Donald Trumps say there when he talks about the money, he says, is the money going to be in cash . Is that something that jury is going to think . Wow, what a responsible businessman know, this. I mean, i think the jury is going to think why didnt you say ganim, office. I mean trump is involved in this. I hope is like a mob tape, im and Michael Cohen certainly has adopt or i guess used to adopt that persona or seems like a lot of people in the Trump Organization adopted that have been saying like our friend david i mean, all i would hear this speaking in code, i mean, jeffrey, you and i were having it probably at the exact same thoughts at the exact same moment because it actually brings me back to the Fani Willis Proceedings and georgia where trumps lawyers tried to make a whole thing about how she paid for things in cash and heres trump saying 130,000 he was suggesting that they pay are faring Hundred Grand in cash. You have a one elected district attorney. Yeah. But one is a businessman and arthur handles casual. The jury is sitting there and theyre just going to be alive who does that who want a paper we have at least we have two lawyers on the panel. We have a financial person, jury. We have a Finance Person it may not be in the world of business. So what business is it that you know about where 100,000, 30,000 in cash hes routine unless youre doing business in some part of the world where you my brand house closings with different kinds. There are different kinds of into it is not so its not organized crime when were talking about getting somebody killed . Yes. Michael cohen has embraced this on the fixer and the way he talks and the way he handled themselves. But if you listen to that tape, ladies and gentlemen, jury, you know, would proves his guilty. Michael cohen. What does trump say . Okay, 130,000. But Michael Cohen, whose voice from people who i spoke to in the courtroom, they said what came out of the tape today wasnt trumps voice. Will you barely hear . It . Was Michael Cohens booming voice in that courtroom . And i think elie said earlier, theyre dirty being up Michael Cohen with their own witnesses to china like lay the groundwork, get ready, ladies and gentlemen, because youre going to hear from a sleazy guy, but anderson, ive been involved with a lot of trials. Ive never had a prosecutors calling their own witnesses to dirty up their main witness. That is just not normal, but to their time to take out this thing. First of all, its not as if this is a figure who has had his voice altered throughout the course of the last several years. We dont know is identity. Michael cohen has a very known figures so much though it was a part of the conversation in terms of even Jury Selection and his hayden, who they might have known, hafner, where there were the case. And so they are aware of who it is. But to be honest, its not as if most crimes or witnessed by a bus full of nuns, there there witness by people who sometimes are comparison with the i agree. I agree with while everyone a happy, but i appreciate that you do. But let me ill say this were thinking about what i think that they are trying to do i think theyre trying to make this jury say and this is how things are done, this how the sausage is made, this is a shakedown, of course, a very, very wealthy man who says hes very, very wealthy, they get hit up all the time im about people alleging that theyve got his story. Boy, do i have a story to tell you . Theyre not so much, i think painting this on the hopes that people suddenly have an epiphany about their opinion about a wellknown figure, maybe like Michael Cohen, as much as thinking will hold on. This is, this is kinda how things are done. I guess if youre rich someones got a target on your back financially, thats one of the way physical to try to do so combine that with the idea of why youre hearing Michael Cohens voice they want to suggest that he is a sycophant who only wanted to please. There was no intimation, there was no suggestion. He took it upon himself, but thats why the prosecution has got to make their case. It was never going to be a cake walk, but theyve got approved. This is not innuendo theyre going to try to present the attaboy that comes after, not is it cashman and an unknown and a no. And then what happened later . Remember we just mother, baby pecker. Thank you. From trump. Thank you for your help with the situations. He hadnt emissions the white house, he even sits in a room with a microphone. I was getting extorted. Stormy daniels says, were going to lose leverage if the if he loses if he loses the presidency we need to get my money. I want my mother i know. Corrects it on redirect by the prosecutors, it davidson, miss testified to that based on the way that the crossexamination went on reading direct, he said that he wasnt quoting Stormy Daniels. He was quoting her Publicist Boyfriend who was just about to give an interview saying that hes the one that was something that probably had some impact on the jury. They were initially initially heard this for the first time as though it was Stormy Daniels saying that, and then a regional wasnt Stormy Daniels who said that she would lose leverage. It was the, public. Also, he published a blog or something of some kind he, he had written. Well, they were trying to trump sun was trying to suggest that he wrote the blog post in 2011 on the dirty. Com blog that initially surfaced this daniels trump liaison and then they never quite got it, confirmed that he actually did but he worked for the record. If you have a publicist was boyfriend for something called the dirty. Com . Probably not a good idea Extortion Theory here tonight. The one thing that was clear as all this was being negotiated is that Stormy Daniels had other options. Other people were interested in this story and they were trying to keep her from telling it publicly. And i believe she told you this in her interview that she just she didnt want it to be out there. She knew what people would say the attacks on her, the names what would happen, and to other people could have bought the story. She could have sold it to someone else. And made that much. If we could just talk about Michael Cohen. I know you want to make Michael Cohen out to be the worst person ever any federal jury that convicted of talking the judge what is exactly exactly what buddies, arrows, bill hearable terrible, and who was it . Who hired Michael Cohen year after years to work for . There . I have represented guys who worked Assistant To The President of American Express the Assistant To The President of American Express merges breast seems to be a pretty prestigious thing. Theres the president know what direct underlings are doing in that particular case absolutely. Michael cohen has, donald trump has no idea what my nose is. A tape is going to come out where trump says, you handle it, you just deal with this because thats what you do when youre running for president , when youre a billionaire, when you are the president , you delegate and the defense here, youre is your hypothesis is that Michael Cohen was excellent most of the time but suddenly, what youre saying youre saying trump didnt know that he was corrupted. We just played the tape were with trump really involved he and also david pecker has already testified and a photo was shown in court of him walking past the rose garden, but we know the conversation was trumps saying, hows our girl karen, or hows karen debts . Hi, thats not illegal. Once you illegals what went in the book, thats the crime youre saying. Trump is seemingly unaware of. I dont think that early at this this photo was taken according to david pecker trump is asking him with all the worlds problems that he must be my shoulders and the white house place thats david pecker, nothing illegal about. Im not saying its the league. Im just saying hes hes in the white house and hes concerned about Karen Mcdougal and ishee going to remain my point is is talking about all right, there i think anderson cooper, i think theyre going to have a very hard time proving that donald trump said in the logbook in our office, which were not presenting to anyone, put it down this way, so it goes that way. He just says michael i spoke to weisselberg, whos also a jareh jail, right now. If dont trump with the principle is saying, oh, lets pay in cash or less, paying cash, want the world to note, right . So he probably, what he very well might like if hes so concerned about it being paid in cash maybe you would want to know where to run down the other things that kara kara just mentioned that that came into evidence today was Donald Trumps sort of indicating oh, he didnt really want to pay this money. He was sort of upset about it. I read that to be one of those pieces of evidence that could go either way, either to this idea that he just it doesnt like to hand out his money to anyone in general or that he was upset about paying money when he felt under pressure to do so. I mean, to me that seems to also be something that could that could actually work in his favor was fascinating to it, was listening to everyone we are unpacking and parsing each word and monday morning, quarterbacking these jurors hear it in real time when you clarified a point of cross you have to wonder are the jurors actually picking up on those nuances . Great. What are they remembering in these moments . Are they thinking to themselves . Does the rose garden picture resonate in the same way . Did Stormy Daniels boyfriend or where it was saying it and remember, theyre not just using what they know here and much as we tell jurors to do so, we heard that video or audio tape years ago, Michael Cohen and people who may remember having heard that audio tape and they remember some of the details of this case. And so i have to wonder what good is gonna happen . In the deliberation rooms. Are they as focused and looking at the nuance or is it to the advanced the defense to keep them from stipulates, they have every mundane detail you remember the cspan executive, you remember the time to get fizz document then in that document and because the more they have to add that kitchen sink thats a form of delay. This could also apply the prosecutions tactic of sort of painting a very broad picture of What Kind Of World was donald trump and what kind of person was donald trump . Because if youre a juror, youre probably sitting there thinking, who does that, right . Like, every time Something Like that comes up there, just thinking, wait second who does that that is probably at the end of the day. What is going to drive their big picture understanding of what kind of person is donald trump, what kind of business was he engaged in . What would he really have parted ways with this kind of money without knowing what it was for. Arthur. Arthur has over 30,000 right now were going to take a break. Well see you was left after the cash has been handed out. Much more head including some key moments from the Trial Transcript that weve just gotten, including the defenses effort to take attention away from Stormy Daniels and down trumps her desire to buyer who by her silence and put the scrutiny and set on Michael Cohen and Keith Davidson who made the deal happy with in here. 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So Keith Davidson recounts on the stand a conversation that he says he had with Michael Cohen. This was during the transition, david its ends in a Department Store in december, i guess, of 2020. And he says, quote he said something to the effect of jesus christ. Can you effing believe im not going to washington after everything ive done for that fn guy, i cant believe im not going to washington. Ive saved that guys asieh so many times. You dont even know probably lets heater says and did in the davids as is. And then and then question is, im sorry, i didnt mean to interrupt you. Davidson says and then he made reference to he said, you know, i never even got paid that fin guy is not even paying me back the 130,000 and then they made clear the hundred 30,000 and theyre talking about what did you mean by that last . As part i never got paid, repaid the uh, hundred and 30,000 from the deal with Stormy Daniels. So again, where you have there is complaining about the money, but also complaining about not going to washington, nothing appointed to a job somewhere in the trump administration. I remember that though, because Michael Cohen was devastated and what what Keith Davidson testified to his correct. That he thought he would be Attorney General or chief of staff, or some prominent role in the Michael Cohen thought he would be attorney yeah. Okay. Lets not forget that period. But entirely possible after trump won the election, i mean, the figures that were going in and out of trump tower that people that he wanted to see where Michael Cohen is someone who wanted to always elevate himself in trumps thighs. He had lunch with mark cuban and he had them said paparazzi there. So trump would see him having lunch with mark cuban and so he was always someone who thought that trump would be loyal back to him. I think thats really also the tail of what were seeing here, which is we only know this because Michael Cohen said a lot of this publicly, even though people discredit him, i understand that. But Michael Cohen came forward and flipped on trump, even though trump was once confident, and its something its a known quantity now, the breakdown in the relationship, but for people who knew them, i mean, Michael Cohen is someone who is completely loyal to donald trump and did not get that loyalty back and retard, of course, he must have known that that was a possibility because he taped that call yeah. I mean, he taped the call for a reason a probably to substantiate that the agreement had been made, but also to ensure that it was on the record that he had put this money down for donald trump so the idea that Michael Cohen from the beginning questioned whether prompt would be good for the his his side of the deal, the money and id all event i think was always there. He always suspected that trump would tell us wife about this. I mean, hes calling Keith Davidson. Im not sure. Many other people knew that Michael Cohen actually had done this at that time. Rudy giuliani, obviously later new because he said it on fox news. But Michael Cohens wife didnt even know that this had occurred, and that works two ways. Remember, we heard the testimony from the banker to suggest that he had a certain amount of Money In The Bank and then he wanted to match that because his wife buckle cohens wife, looked at all the finances and he was trying to be very secretive about all these different aspects of it. Now, if youre the defense, how are you going to use that youre going to say . This man has lied to every branch of government and his wife, but you want it to believe him right now, but if you are the prosecution, think about your working backwards, youre thinking about your closing argument, how to sum out of all things have happened here. And one thing you want to sum up is the use of the word that berman just read repaid or not . I thought if i did this, he might do this. He hasnt even repaid me and you combine the word repaid with the audio tape has been recorded, does suggest that there has been some meeting of the minds between donald trump and Michael Cohen about an event that would take place. And then he did not make good on his promise. I remember. When is he . Thank this. Can you believe im not going to go to the white house with him. Hes won an election that the damage has been, at least not done, but it has been contained and you add it all . No. That the crime is called are not the crime. In other words, they could prove all day long following that he paid 130,000 in cash and checked and credit card. Thats not the crime. And anderson okay. We have some fun with the cash part, but thinking about it, if youre paying for a Confidentiality Agreement, thats the legal term and its hush money is its media, but the legal terms of Confidentiality Agreement typically you dont want to be what a big track record of what heres a check for 130,000 to Stormy Daniels floating around the universe, like really wanted 30,000 thats why attorney should not have had him talking in front of the courthouse at one point in time. Remember this last week donald trump comes out and tries to try to create and fighting the conversation suggests all ive done right all the time is i wrote on a memo line for Legal Services. I paid an attorney for Legal Services by weight that could possibly come back to haunt him why . Because what i just said if the agreement was made. And now the mission accomplished, is that i have won the election and the purpose of having to repay you is now about what ive written in the Business Records. I no longer have the same level of exposure, so they have to craft that all together. Youre right in isolation in a vacuum. You cannot just sort of pick and choose and say aha, this one sentence but the cumulative aspect for this prosecution pointbypoint is what theyre going towards for that falsified Business Records. And again, that trying to hide an underlying crime. And remember, this is what the prosecution is going to hope to do, is say, this is mostly a documents case is that the checks exist. The checks to Stormy Daniels exist, and the checks to come into to pay Michael Cohen back exist. The Business Records exist where the payments are characterized as as legal fees the only issue in the case, ultimately, as you keep pointing out, is donald, did donald trump know that these false indications are on the Business Records and the second part and the being used to commit another crime. They kitchen, he cant just be that its on the books. Thats thats statue of limitations. Now, thats a misdemeanor. Thats gone. Its gotta be yes, donald trump news on the books and then knew it was in furtherance of another crime. Its pieces that but thats the easy part because that other crime is campaign. Everybody ago, which one state of federal . We have. It could be both. It doesnt matter. It doesnt matter does it matter that the record, the Business Records, i mean, isnt the defense arguing these are personal records that these are not Business Records submitted to the irs. These are internal trump commit. Its still a crime its still doesnt have to be he doesnt have to be submitted to be like an iron. Andersons point. Hes not charged with filing a false ensured that is another crime. He is not charged with that. Its falsifying Business Records, which as you correctly pointing out, its an internal document . Not that he gave it to the federal Election Committee or the irs or anyone else here . Hundreds of crimes that hes not charged with but he actually is charged with the one that is a crime. But anderson making a valid point. In other words, its not that he craves someone filled this out and submit it and said this is the truth. It was in a desk in someones desk in an office, but the state of new york has decided that it is a crime. Its to have a false, just to be clear, its a misdemeanor that at this point is barred by the statute of limitations, and it only comes to life if they could prove that it was in furtherance of another crime. And ellie always say about the tape about Michael Cohen, one of the first questions im one of the first areas on crossexamination is how many other times have you recorded donald trump . Because ill bet the hundred and 30,000 i got in my pocket. That thats not the only time he recorded a really good question about how many other times hes hes done this to a degree because to me, if youre the prosecution, what you want, what you want to indicate is that Michael Cohen knew that what he was doing, first of all, was shady. He wanted it on tape that he was doing it for trump with trumps knowledge. And the election looms large over that. And if they can substitute dan shi aid that the reason he was worried about getting this on tape, maybe this will come out when microcode takes the stand, is because the stakes here, what i recorded all my conversation and so canada, he says i recorded all my im just its a valid question. I mean Attorney Client pointed but maybe but i think valid question that i think Michael Cohen will have to heal, have to explain why in that particular moment it was important to tape it and it seems to me the president ial election is not irrelevant in that conversation. I say, one other thing is that, is it youre talking about this being a documents case. It may be it may be very dry, but there are a lot of home when the prosecution is getting stuff in there. Thats not dry at all. And this in the control and just see, you know, this is what graphic number three is for the 9 00 hour here it has to do with the relationship that Stormy Daniels had with donald trump. Allegedly right. And they get this into evidence here today. Steinglass, the prosecutor asks, so let me direct you to two parts. In particular, this is of a statement that Stormy Daniels and Keith Davidson crafted the first two sentences when it states that shame is daniels was contacted by certain news outlets alleging she had a sexual and romantic affair with donald trump many, many years ago. And then it states that thats absolutely false. How was that technically correct . The prosecutor s. Davidson responds, well, i think you have to hone in on the definition of romantic sexual, and affair. The prosecutor says, okay. Can you explain that . Davidson says, well, i dont think that anyone had ever alleged that any interaction between sheet and mr. Trump was romantic and then steinglass says, okay, how about sexual and the davidson responds, well, that would be a sexual or romantic. So yes, this may be a documents case, but there has to be a reason the prosecution is doing everything they can to show there is some pretty simi behavior. There was also something in the transcripts understand about Keith Davidson and his surprise on Election Night, that donald trump had one, what did he say that night and necessity . Theres a text Message Exchange between Keith Davidson and dylan howard, who of course work for david pecker. And just to really quickly through this, this is the First Exchange and Attacks Davidson says, yes, what did you say . Davidson says, what have we done steinglass, the prosecutor says, what did you mean by that, mr. Davidson . Davidson says, well, that was sort of a Gallows Humor for and it was on Election Night as a result for coming in and there was a sort of surprise amongst the broadcaster and others at donald trump was leading in the polls and there was a growing sense that folks were about to be ready to call the election. The prosecutor says, and you referred to it as Gallows Humor. Can you explain that a little more . What did you mean . Why did you say what have we done davidson, he says, i think there was an understanding this is a text between dylan howard and i, and there was an understanding that our efforts may have in some way, i should strike that. That our activities may have in some way assisted the president ial campaign of donald trump an important, well, i mean part of the charges in this case is that all of these transactions, all of this money was ultimately to benefit Donald Trumps campaign. And what they are saying is my god, it worked. And thats part of the case. Some berman thanks very much for the transcripts coming up. The former president uses his free weekday this week to campaign in wisconsin and revive an old threat. How that could tie into this trial has former White House Communications director joins us now its pretty today. Look at the suns and every days the same look in hotels. Com i have to find your perfect somewhere my Mental Health was matter, but im movements called Teeny Tardive Dyskinesia started to surrounding like day td felt embarrassing. I felt like disconnecting. I asked my doctor about treating my td and learned about in grad in greta is clinically proven for reducing td. 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He finds himself at odds with and on recent day off, he expressed a similarly dark view of the electoral process. If things dont go his way hi, his lights, the former president was campaigning wednesday, his off day in wisconsin, just outside of milwaukee. He also gave an interview to the local newspaper, the journal sentinel, and for the third president ial campaign in a row, he began Laying Groundwork for not accepting the results of this novembers election he said this of the upcoming wisconsin vote, quote, if everythings honest, ill gladly accept the results. If its not, you have the fight, you have to fight the right for the right of the country, which raises the question, of course, what happens if this trial doesnt turn out in his favor . Joining our panel, former Communications Director and the trump white house. So less far, griffin i dont think it surprises you that he would say this a third time about this upcoming election, but remarkable to see him just boldly saying that well, and whats also remarkable is this trial, which is incredibly important is happening. But in some ways it kinda superseded this incredible fulltime interview that donald trump gave and his own words, which is laying out verbatim what aids like myself have warned for the last four years that a second term would be mass deportations, Detention Camps for undocumented migrants in the country, weaponizing the Department Of Justice going after political adversaries and just really paying this picture of a fundamentally unamerican i can second term, hes also openly talking about contesting Election Results before even having them. I worry that in this moment that were in these very scary things arent getting quite the attention that they can. Were living in such a fastpaced media environment. I dont necessarily see the Biden Campaign doing enough to really raise the stakes here and say this is how dangerous this moment is its yes, he will absolutely contest the results of the election. Did it once before. So hes raised the bar so high for based on everything hes always said that at a certain point, it just becomes noise. I go, yeah, of course he would say this and people dont even pay attention. People do tune it out. Yes, i will never forget when trump was asked it in the Briefing Room that de and he equivocated and wouldnt say whether or not he would accept the results of the election. It was the middle of covid thats what everyone is primary rarely asking questions about. And that was the first time he had said it in such a public forum. I know youd set it in 2016 and he had referenced it before. But this is donald trump. This is what he does. He did this in the town hall a year ago. He said, ill accept the results of the next election if its an honest election, the person who decides that in terms might is donald trump just point out that what he said in that interview is almost word for word, what he said on the ellipse on january 6th, you have to fight and about an election result. You dont like and they fought at the capitol on january 6. Hes saying the same thing. Yeah. And expecting presumably the same result. I didnt want its also the court. What are you saying in court, right. If he will his his acceptance is always contingent on a result being favorable. Its only going to be a fair system where a fair trial or a fair jury, if it results in what he believes to be, it should be an acquittal. Lets play what he said after courts well, im not allowed to test if i am under a gag i can testify if now were going to be appealing the games im not allowed to testify theres this judge whos telling think conflicted. As be under a unconstitutional gag order. Nobodys ever had that paid for obviously, that is false at the time. Shes reaction is someone that was sort of like a not like a news. And then uh yes. My heart breaks for him, a photonic because ive been in those positions where you have a client larger than life, but not but not in this league, former president all right. I just said not in that league. Yeah. But okay. But mr. Weinstein had a lot to say, mr. Herschel, that is the last thing Rudy Giuliani has allowed to say Alan Dershowitz says a lot today. Anthony weiner, as lets say, roger else that a lot to say. So yeah, ive had some clients by the way, i had a lot of all those suffering in the world. I think your heart can break for some other say it was we taught in that position to have made his choices yes. I agree with you. But when you have a guy like that saying something thats ridiculous on two levels, theres never been a gag order like that before. Thats ridiculous. Thats not true and i can testify because the gag order thats elementary knowledge. I mean, my highschool sudden knows that you are allowed to testify. Thats not true. So you sit there like schmoll kind of as youre okay, mr. President. But i mean, those words to come out of his mouth are ridiculous. I think the other thing just to merge the two story lines here, trump fundamentally is always trying to sort of break down the institutions any system any procedure, any process that is unfavorable to him is fundamentally unfair in his view. That goes for elections, that goes for this court in manhattan, that goes for the court in georgia. It goes for the court in florida where hes being tried in the documents case so knowing that when it comes to the elections, which is really the whole ball game what does the country do when hes basically saying what hes what his game plan is Going Forward. When you asked republicans, as im sure, all of us will over the next six months. What are you going to do different this time around compared to the last time around when he laid the predicate for january 6, if the answer is were gonna do the same thing we did last last time, which is basically say that this is Donald Trumps rhetoric and it doesnt matter that i think tells us everything we need to know about whats going to happen, Going Forward it has not seemed to me like Establishment Republicans or whoever else in the Republican Party who are the ones who ultimately will have to make their choices here. Their behavior is not really changed and so it suggests that donald trump is just going to play the same playbook and it might have the same result, except that this time around, people are more ready for it. Well, i mean, caitlin spoke to senator jd vance last night, and also i want to play this for you because she she asked him if Terms Treatment of mike pence on january 6 gave him any pauses. This is what he said caitlin, im extremely skeptical that mike pences life was ever in danger. I think politics and politics people like to really exaggerate things from time to time a lot of senator, a lot of folks the democratic party, kaitlan, act as if January The 6th was the scariest moment of their lives. I think look, january 6 was a bad day. It was a riot, but the idea that donald trump endangered anyones lives when he told them to protest peacefully. Its just absurd i mean obviously writers were Chanting Hang mike pence. Its just stunning. I mean, yes, Riders Channing Hang Mike Pence Gallows being erected on the south lawn i know mike pences security detail. Ive traveled the world with them. They do not mess around. Ive spoken to them after january 6, they feared for his life and mike pence chose not to stay even though he was at risk. They reload kate at him. It was just a rewriting of history, j. D. Vance knows thats not true. And by the way, is somebody whos been on the Receiving End of Death Threats from maga world, it should not be stunning to anyone that people would threaten somebody for going against salma also, theres videos of other republican senators who were there that day running from the rioters is they were breaking in and i thought whats so interesting, and this is important for people who dont know is j. D. Vance is on Donald Trumps vp shortlist. He is someone who could be in the role that mike pence was on that day . Hes made clear he would not do what mike pence did and stand in the way of sending the fake slates of electors to congress. He believes congress should fight that out, essentially define the constitution. And i just think it speaks to the moment of what hes in and the question was, does it give you any pause . How trump is treated . Mike pence, a lifelong conservative, and didnt even call mike pence that de when he was up there and mike pences said that donald trump put his life in danger, also his family who was with him. So hes made that clear, but it does speak to abbys point about who is going to be around donald trump if he is if he is going to be potentially put back in the white house it could be people who say they wont stay away at this point effective by the way, as youre talking about it, this is Supreme Court right now that is deliberating as to whether he would have immunity absolute immunity. So weve talked about who would surround a future president or somebody who might return to the oval office if it president has absolute immunity, it doesnt matter whos to his left, more whose to his right or any one because no one above them. Thats the whole point. The law would even be below him and thats part of what the consideration is Going Forward. Remember, there are asking for conditional, the way he talks about conditional, asking for absolute immunity and all that is being contemplated did nine justices have to consider it . Stay with us coming up, who will testify next still a lot of big names to hear from, including someone once considered to be one of the former president s most trusted aides in the white house. Lets add ever miss before youre preventing my thing with q left. Youll never truly forget migraine, but zero migraine days are possible dont take if allergic to lift up those kind im the side effects are nausea, constipation, sleepiness, heel up, theft, that forget you have migraines shop etsy until may 12 and get up to 30 off special mothers day gifts that go beyond the usual suspects but if she wants candles, our selection is less order until may 12th for up to 30 off Personalized Jewelry fresh start original decor, and other things. 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So clearly you so tick to why choose a sleep numbers smart bad. Can it keep me warm when im cold . Weight know, im always hot. Sleep number. Does that can i make my side softer . I like my sayyed firmer speak number. Does that can help us sleep better and better . Sleep number . Does that 94 of smart sleepers report better sleep safe, 40 on the sleek numbers, limited Edition Smart bad, 4d, 0 interest for 36 months. Shop. Now its sleep number. Com. Im tom foreman in washington on this is cnn anticipation is building for who we may hear from him tomorrow is hearing and whether itll be any of the highprofile witnesses to come, including possibly former white house counselor hope hicks, once considered one of the foreign presence closest confidantes and most trusted aides back here with the team in new york when whos on the san tomorrow, who starts off tomorrow . Do we know they havent said for sure they dont announce this obviously publicly, but but what theyve been doing is folding in the super interesting juicy witnesses. Would those who bring the records, i think it could be more of the records people potentially silly, but i do think after that, there is an open question of who fits next in this narrative hope hicks has been widely speculated about toys. We dont know that it is going to be her, but in that audio tape that they played in the courtroom today, it does. I believe you can hear her voice in the background. She was obviously around for those key conversations with Michael Cohen, so she could be a natural fit potential was how or hope hicks and Kellyanne Conway seen in the trump world today so two very different figures on hope i started with their boat since i didnt the white house, she had one focus. Shes not ideological. Shes not particularly partisan. Her role in the white house was to protect donald trump at all costs. She sees herself as a trump loyalist. First and foremost, im a little surprised that theres been some kind of media scuttle, but that perhaps shes really going to turn on him and this is going to be a big moment where she reveals what he did wrong. I think shes going to tell the truth as instructed by her attorneys, but i think she will stay very well within the lines of anything she what wont want to say anything thats incriminating to the former president and Kellyanne Conway. I mean, shes still clings to the inner circle. Shes from a certain perspective advising the campaign right now. I dont know that either are a slam dunk for the prosecution in any sense. Yeah. I mean, in many ways, think about why youd want remember, they cannot play the access Hollywood Tape they are not allowed to its two prejudicial according to the judge, they can reference the fallout from the access Hollywood Tape for Framing Purposes of the prosecution, you want to make the connection that the reason why he was motivated to try to falsify a Business Record or even pay this person differently than he had to have Karen Mcdougal was because they were concerned about the impact to the campaign from the fallout of the access Hollywood Tape. So if youve got emails, if youve got discussions, if youve got communications with hope as the Connecting Dot between the campaign and the fallout of access hollywood to where we are now. Thats when theyre most useful. And she need not frankly, even be somebody to turn on trump or to me, or to turn against sam she asked to be somebody to say, well, look, it was contemplated the fallout was major. We thought there was a chance that if there was one more straw that fell on perhaps the evangelical vote or back, or the women voters back, or just the electoral voters in general that could have been the end of the campaign. Thats the concern you have to convey. I think one of the most interesting questions about the prosecution is this point is do they call Karen Mcdougal and even do they call Stormy Daniels . Thats because thats a great point. Do you think they need to as a technical legal matter . I dont think so. I mean, the checks have been introduced. The purpose behind the checks have been introduced and so they dont have to prove that the sex took place. Thats not part of the case. And they may think that the prosecutors may think this is too much of a spectacle, too much of a sideshow. And so i dont know. I mean, i think Stormy Daniels is likely because it is her transaction that is really in the heart of this case. But Karen Mcdougal, its its essentially background information. The prosecution has has already put forward all about the transaction. I dont know if they need her. So before i get to that point, when you talk about tomorrow, its all about strategy, right . And when your Defense Attorney youre exhausted, you you a literally exhausted. And if you put on the prosecution puts on a key witness tomorrow on Friday The Fence has saturday, and sunday to see. Okay. This is the direct theyre going to have daily copy and think could really prepare very well for the crossexamination on monday. So when i was a prosecutor, i tried to put on like nonsensical when no big deal witnesses, but on a friday on a friday, so that i dont give the advantage it is attorney to have that weekend prep what jeffrey is saying though, is ive been thinking about that. Do they really need Stormy Daniels . But if you give the defense the opportunity to go up there and say, i am as a Defense Attorney, i am telling you my client has always said he didnt have sex with Stormy Daniels and this was a shakedown. These were absolutely false allegations and this is a just paid this money just to even if it was for the president ial election, it changes. Now he really is a victim of extortion. So i think theyre going to have to bring her in and shes going to say, yes, we had sex where when as a Defense Attorney, you would and you are representing trump, you would not want Stormy Daniels and Karen Mcdougal to testify, correct . But you know what, you dont have to remember one of the objections that came during the opening, which we all know, Opening Statement ejections are pretty rare. Want to kinda have everyone have their flow one flat comment that instantly got sustained by the judge was was alluding that stormy was an extortionist thats something that the judge is going to have on a very tight leash. Number one. Number two, it really doesnt matter if they actually were engaged in a sexual affair, anything any more than it matters whether at that time, and his gosh, with billy bush, he really did ghraieb and the p. All that matters is the fallout idea of whether it would impact how he was perceived enough to motivate him to make a payment and falsified may ask you just in terms of the impressions to the jury, if they hear that donald trump has denied even knowing curtain going to go over, denied. And you already have testimony from david pecker saying he would ask about Karen Mcdougal repeatedly calling her our girl and karen saying shes a nice girl does it help to actually have them . On the stand to tell their side of the story and the jury than if they believe those two, then they are less likely to believe donald trump. Well, yeah, hes lying about that. I mean, yes. But it also as a strategic reason, even though i know conceptually, i dont need to have this to check off the boxes to maybe movement make my elements ive got a jury whose leaning into the most i want them in the palm of my hand to be leaning in to know on these moments what youre hearing is so important. Number one, number two, its going to look bad for the prosecution. You mean theres all this talk about medical comments or manuals. I dont call them a juror is going to think themselves will hold a wire. Why are we not hearing from them . And you have to play its that same level of risk for the prosecution if Defense Attorney, my summation, were all used to be just underscore just the differences between Karen Mcdougal and Stormy Daniels. I think come into play here. Karen mcdougals relationship with trump is much more of a relationship Stormy Daniels, theres debate about whether or reduce that she was in love with me. Yeah. Exactly. So i think that that that also is going to come into play too, in terms of trumps credibility and denying these affairs. Thank everybothe news continues, so deserve special Primetime Scene and trial coverage right after a short break welcome to the roots of our legacy. Were excellence comfort and electricity for every welcome to beyond. The Mercedes My Buck Eq Suv switch to shopify. So you can build it better scale is faster and sell more much more take your business to the next stage when you switch to shopify water would help with this dry spots. Thats long disease. 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