Strikes Many Americans as contrary . Most fundamental democratic principles, yes, he said, no. In fact, he said, i think a lot of people like it all right. Eric, thank you. And thanks to all of you. Its time for ac30, 60 good evening. Thanks for joining our special palm time coverage and the trump hush money criminal trial. They nine saw something remarkable former president held in Contempt Of Court and threatened with jail time. And the lawyer who represented two of the women who alleged affairs with trump, testifying about the deals he made to buy their silence, the contempt ruling made history and made the man you see there, a convicted criminal, judge, juan merchan, finding he violated the gag order. He is under nine times quoting from his ruling, this Court Rejects defendants arguments and finds that the people have established the elements of Criminal Contempt beyond a reasonable doubt. Criminal contempt, no, sitting or former president has ever been found guilty of any crime before. Big or small until today. The sources of Kaitlan Collins was in the courtroom in a moment, well talk with her about what she we saw a judge one or sean phi find the former president the maximum 1,000 for each count and warned them that further violations could land him in jail is not only unique, its totally constitution. Judges totally conflicted, totally absolutely conflicted that easily in this case im supposed to be in georgia. Im supposed to be new hampshire. Im supposed to be in ohio. Thats over the place and they have these sitting here for biden trial. Thats a Vitamin Trial in fact, its not and theres no evidence that it is. The judge said thursday for hearing on for other alleged gag order violations and testimony will continue thursday from former Karen Mcdougal and Stormy Daniels attorney, Keith Davidson, who was on the stand today as well. And as we talked about what he said on the stand today, were also monitoring Lead Developments at Columbia University where Protests Ssrs are occupying one of the buildings and hundreds of new York Police Officers, members of the Department Strategic response team, adjust, arrived outside campus. So were going to continue to watch that closely and well bring you any updates but the trials where we turn now with us tonight, new yorks Criminal Defense Attorney arthur aidala, bestselling author and former federal prosecutor future for thuban, former Defense Attorney informed Baltimore Mayor stephanie rawlings, blake, cnns Kaitlan Collins, cnn senior legal analyst, elie honig, and cnns kara scannell, who was also in the court. So Caitlin Karelin started for you. What were your impressions good. Well, i mean, karen nose, this place, like the back of her hand. This is my first time inside the courtroom since the trial has started today the first thing thats so it out to me was who came inside the room with trump because i was told last week he was very sensitive to reporting that none of his allies were really there that largely, with the exception of his defense team, he was kind of a loan, one of his family had been there until today. None of his family had been there today. Eric trump was there today, but it wasnt just eric trump that was in the room. It was a slew of political blades and allies as well. We saw Trumps Campaign manager, a campaign adviser. We also saw the Texas Attorney general, ken paxton, the one that was facing impeachment a few months ago, that trump publicly supported was in there, David Mackintosh from the Conservative Club For Growth was also in there. And so it was just a notable moment to see trumps surrounded by hi, this front row of his aides, given, there, you would not really seen a ton of that. Some of his political advisors and other attorneys to been in there. But you hadnt seen that level of support and clearly, he was trying to change that narrative that had emerged last week that he was largely alone in the room and eric trump was seated next to susie wiles lets the Trump Campaign manager, who is in the room. They were paying very close attention as the evidence was being presented, as the Text Messages with keith Keith Davidson, the witness today was on the screen. I was watching them and they were watching and reading along very closely with the rest of us in the courtroom. Kara, what stood out to you . I mean, those barrage of Text Messages are really telling between Keith Davidson and dylan howard of the National Enquirer as they were, they were fits and starts them trying to get these deals together. But also the impact on the campaign was something that we saw contemporaneously. These were the Text Messages they sent at the time it was something they were actively concerned about, which is part of the prosecutions theory. But i also thought it was so interesting, we were already getting a sense of who Michael Cohen is by the adjectives and descriptions that several witnesses have used when talking about their interactions with Michael Cohen exactly. Complimentary agitator they are not i mean, i wrote down a few jerk a whole aggressive barrage of insults and situations. And Keith Davidson said, the more moral of the story is no one wanted to talk to cohen. So its already giving the jury a sense of who this guy is. So when he comes in on the stand, they wont be surprised by his personality and casey does get defensive during some of this questioning, but just think is really interesting that youre getting the sense of who he is before youve even seen him. And Keith Davidson is a really compelling witness. This this is firsttime on the stand day for for people who dont recognize his name. He was the attorney who negotiated these deals for Karen Mcdougal and Stormy Daniels. He no longer represents them. I think youre and mcdougal was unhappy with her representation. Well, i mean, he said today that he took 45 of her sixfigure cut that she got. So i dont understand that everybody involved in the de allied, Karen Mcdougal is also variable upset with it and was upset when he later was putting pictures of her on his website to say that she was a former client, but that notwithstanding, i mean, its a cd world and he was very blunt about it. And Text Messages that he had sent, he was the one who sent the text message that said, what have we done the night of the election because he clearly thought that what they had done had benefitted trump. But hes a compelling witness. A sense that he makes jokes with the jurors at times he was making fun, making very clear how he felt about Michael Cohen at times comparing into a squirrel, even a Written Account of what you gave, just notes that he was making eye contact with the jury, like he debited would actually address the jury. Yeah. So when prosecutors would ask him a question, he sometimes look directly the prosecutor, but often i would notice karen are both sitting in there. He would look directly at the jurys whos kinda telling a story. It wasnt just a yes or no answer. He was very genuine seeming as he was providing this testimony, and he would sometimes get asked a question what did this person mean to you . And they said that trump is really tight with money or Something Like that and he would kind of pause and you but trump is sitting there person is lives, and then you would say that trump is very frugal. He also drew through line between trump and Michael Cohen had said he very much believed that trump was behind these negotiations. And just in my experience, prosecutors do encourage a witness to talk to the jury. If they can. Its a really interesting tactical point. I never actually told a witness where to look because the last can you wanted them to do is get crossexamined on he told you everything including where to look, but theres really two ways this happens some jurors dont want to break that fourth wall and so if lets say two bins cross examining me, theyre only looking at the lawyer backandforth. Others are looking right into the jury box and sort of communicating. And i obviously like the latter, if the person is credible and personable and based on kaitlan and qarrah account, it sounds like Keith Davidson was now if its a really dangerous, scary, violent guy, then i dont want them looking in the jury box if hes my cooperating witness because you dont want them freaked out, but it sounds to me from your account, kaitlan Like Davidson made a reasonable legitimate connection with the jury, which youre happy with as a prosecutor . Because a former Defense Attorney, would you encourage witnesses to me if you have a witness coming up like Michael Cohen, who is abrasive and has been sluggish in the past in his behavior when he was working for trump and clearly has lied is it good that these prosecution witnesses are sort of giving advance warning that hes not that pleasant and all these things so that the jury isnt necessarily surprised. Thats already builtin. Michael cohen knows who he is. I dont think hes surprised at all about any of the a whole jerk squirrel. He owns it. And i think its important for the for the jury to have a sense of who is coming on that were not the prosecution is not trying to make Michael Cohen something that he is not he they are showing the jury, this is who he is, but these are the facts. So you might think hes a whole squirrel, whatever but hes telling the truth and we have receipts are there. I mean, theres an attorney would it doesnt take some of the sting out of like, if a juror doesnt like Michael Cohen when he starts testify, if theyve already been kinda four warned, you may not like this guy. Does that help you start from the beginning . I mean, when i was an idea, i had like little crackheads from brooklyn. They but they were my main this is you would vod year the jury and say my main witness is someone whos going to tell you that theyve been arrested five times that the night in question they had a crack pipe in their pocket. But who do you think was going to be in the crack then when when that guy at the Defense Table shot the deceit east so yeah, im telling you right now and anderson, those of us who are old enough to remember john gati in that trial, who put them in prison . Sammy the bull bravado, we killed 19 people. So its a hurdle. That Michael Cohen thing that was large hurdle. Yeah. But they got over. There, was convicted. Be clear. He conspired 19 times. He didnt shoot everyone i mean, lets be fast. Ready to write that he admitted to who knows where but the thing with Michael Cohen, the question that the prosecution is certainly going to ask the jury is yes, he was in a hall. Yes, he was obnoxious. Yes, he was a squirrel, whatever that means i dont. Know who was he. Doing it, for . For whose benefit why was he so why dont we will employed him for years and years and wanted him to be like exactly. So i i think many of us here i know elie has i had my own dealings with Michael Cohen when he worked for trump and he screamed at me in a similar way, but it it was very clear to me that it was because he was advocating for donald trump. And thats gonna be the argument to this jury. But advocating and youre right. He was advocating, but i say things on behalf of clients that the client didnt tell me to say the client doesnt even know what im saying. Im advocating and i would think one of the defenses here is going to be like, hey, Michael Cohen, was a lone wolf. Michael cohen, he had such a vested interests himself in making donald trump the president , because probably you, Michael Cohens why he thought he was gonna be the attorney general, the United States of america will be on the Supreme Court of the United States, will become a billionaire himself. So i think that has to embrace Michael Cohens Embrace Liveness embraces lone wolf attitude and say, trump didnt tell him to do this. He was doing this on his own. But Keith Davidson did not testify that today Keith Davidson testified that Michael Cohen made clear in every chance he got that he was working for donald trump and and he was doing things on his horse. Thats his strain. Im not to saving the polls saying the boss told me to do im not done yet. He also testified that Michael Cohen, it was very clear was acting on trumps behalf that Michael Cohen would not be able to act with his own authority, that he was acting on Donald Trumps authority that was given. Let me jeff, i want to read part of the Gag Order Ruling where the judge addresses trumps claim that that reposts of his comments or retweets or not violations, which is an Argument Trump has made ad infinitum for years now, the judge said, quote, it is counterintuitive, indeed absurd to read the expanded order to not prescribe statements that defendant intentionally selected and published to maximize exposure. This is not to say that a reposts will always be deemed a statement of the poster as context is directly relevant. However, here under the unique facts and circumstances of this case, the only credible findings that the repost constitutes statements of the defendant. You think theres really a significant and also what occurred today is historic. I think it is historic and i think we need to pause and recognize what a big deal this is not just in this trial, but in broad scope of american history, donald trump today is a convicted criminal. This is not a civil judgment. This is not a slip slap on the wrist. This is a finding of Criminal Contempt that had to be proved beyond a reasonable doubt, and thats what the judge did well, the voters care beats the hell out of me, but this is something that i think is worth recognizing that has never come close to happening before in american history. Lagc that one. Yeah, i think its a fair point by jeff, i think we had a very, very powerful ruling by the judge. I mean, were waiting on this thing and the judge came through with i think exactly what he needed to do to reassert control of that courtroom. I mean, trump had run wild with this violated nine times. Theres going to be hearing on thursday. Im sure that will be for more violations. Theres four more at issue. Im sure the judge will find three or four of them. The judge had to get control and hes run very good trial so far. Hes running efficient trial hes keeping things moving within the courtroom itself. Its quite orderly, but trump was going nuts on the outside and he was flagrantly violating the gag order. The judge put his foot down and lets see what happens from here on out because now the judges said, if you do it again, i reserve the right, if necessary. He says if necessary big if i will imprison you but lets see, because trump hasnt violated this thing in fiber. So days, so new record. I going to give a sense of how this judge runs this courtroom he spoken he said, i found trump had violated the Gag Order Nine Times within the first ten minutes, said handed down the order and then it was back to business. Bring the jury and so until you read the order, you didnt see the strength of the language in there. He just did it very matter of fact, lay off the top and then brought the witnesses in and kept the jury in the case on track to more of this amount. Were going to take a quick break, a closer look next. Also, the trial transcript, including more and the testimony Keith Davidson about Michael Cohen and his Recollection Back in 2018 of his first First Encounter with them also tonight, tension growing at Columbia University. Theres a video weve just gotten what it looks like right now on campus, outside Hamilton Hall, which is the bill holding, there has been occupied by protesters, photos, seem to form Day Barricade of sorts with themselves, with hundreds of nypd officers just steps away, poised. It seems to take action. We will be covering all of it in the hours ahead. Well be right back. Bring into savings this moving season with pod. Save up to 25 . Now im moving in storage in cli pods. Its been trusted get over 6 million move, but dont wait, save up to 25 now, oh, visited pot. Com today. But this is carbonic and this is how you can sell us your car. Visit carbonic. 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So i can keep working to take just one 12 hours of uninterrupted painrelated who do you and theyre all coming . Those who are still with us, yes. Grandpa whats this . Your wings. Light em up gentlemen, its a beautiful. Day to fly. Looking in new yorks Morningside Heights neighborhood and Columbia University, a hundreds of new York Police Officers have gathered on broadway outside the university, just steps away from Hamilton Hall, which is the building. The protests are occupied late last night. And continue to hold onto or going to continue to monitor the situation, breakin with any new developments as they come in back to the trial going through attorney and keep davidsons testimonies. Weve been discussing already. Its not hard to feel the looming presence of Michael Cohen or anticipate how his testimony, Demeanor May Land with a jury. Theyve got a pretty good sense of it today, but it was out there already back in 2018, was seen as sort of sidon or talk to davidson about his dealings with cohen . He told sarah then that his First Contact with Michael Cohen was in 2011 when Stormy Daniels, as davidson to demand a website removed the story of her alleged affair with donald trump, and davidson called cohen what was that conversation . Like . When i think its a lot of Chest Pounding yeah, to the best of my recollection, it was a lot of you know, how how dare you and you will chase you to the ends of the earth. And this is not a true story and were going to come and get you you said, whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on, hold your horses and thats not at all the reason for our calling and we said that misdiagnosis does not want the story up and were gonna do our best to take it down. Journey sang with more of what keith davids and said on the stance seen as john berman who has the transcript that gets released late in the day so davidson recounted that 2011 phone call on the stand today. Yeah. He said much the same thing in the sand. That he said to my morning partners, theyre assigned her right there. He recounted being called initially by gina rodriguez, who was Stormy Daniels publicist, and keith davis quote, gina called me up to tell me that quote, some jerk called me and was very, very aggressive and threatened to sue me. And i i would you like keith to call this i hate to ask it this way. But who was that jerk . Davidson responds it was Michael Cohen and then a little bit later, davidson testifies. I called i was transferred to Michael Cohen. I introduce myself before i could barely get my name out. I was just met with like a Hustle Barrage of insults and insinuation in allegations that went on for quite a while. Stein glass, the prosecutor asks, what was the gist of what he was accusing you . To of davidson says, i dont think he was accusing us of anything he was just screaming and jeffrey, i know youve reported on kaitlyn. I know you probably had a relation with Michael Cohen way back when i covered trump way back to 2012. And this is how Michael Cohen would interact with you when he spoke to you . It was generally screaming and trumps attorney, i should note, was grinning points when he was when Keith Davidson was testifying that i never saw trump himself laughing, but but even trumps team was laughing. I mean, everyone who knows Michael Cohen knows how Michael Cohen is. And as he was saying that when they had to say i hate to ask you a silly question, but who was that jerk and he made clear was talking about Michael Cohen. It did prompt around of laughter in the corner court room, by the way. Thats the prosecution whos going to be calling him as their main witness which is the jerk and angry and aggressive stuff that thats thats not good. But whats even a bigger problem for the prosecutions at this same witness said, quote that later who is talking to Michael Cohen and said, i dont believe a word really that you say. I mean, if hes mean are a jerk fine. Who cares . But if the prosecutions witnesses saying i dont believe a word this guy was saying to me, david pepper earlier said he is prone to exaggeration. The banker who started off today said he basically lied to me about every aspect of this transaction is going around his wives back, didnt tell me it was political. So the defense on closing, you i mean so yeah, im stephanie in arthur, you would have a field de with it. Do just the logistics of it as its Criminal Defense Attorney. Im old school. Im not very digital. Im very analog. So when these things are happening, i have a file that says cohen on it. Right. And all of these little lines im just write blue room or ill find the transcript that night and i just put it in, put it and put it out and put it in and then whatever it is, a couple of days a week before colins up there you just start trying to lock Michael Cohen the way the prosecutors laying this foundation in your crossexamination, you have to lay the foundation and you did speak to silent and you did speak to this one. You did speak to that one and then you could stick it up as nose in summation and just say, folks, were going to go piece by piece all the, all of the prosecutors witnesses. This isnt me, mr. Aidala, telling you that witnesses a liar. This is their witnesses telling you their with their the prosecution is clearly trying to get ahead of this of his credibility issues by trying to get as much corroborating evidence, in as possible. And thats why you have these documents that are not the most exciting things to look here about on a stand, but they actually backups. Other things go and say, a lot of this is has been boring, but it is laying the Foundation Brick by brick. And that foundation seems to be very, very strong because they know at the top is going to be a very shaky witness. They can say hes a jerk, they can say hes a whole, they can say hes aggressive. He was he was trumps bulldog and he was acting just in the way that trump wants his current attorneys to add in very aggressive ways. So they are building they are building this foundation. I think very well to be able to support what Michael Cohen is going to say. The classic Prosecutor Line in response to the attacks on a cooperator like this, are the he supposedly ally or how can the prosecution asked you to rely on a witness like this . And the prosecutor says, we didnt choose Michael Cohen to be the witness. Donald trump chose him and itd be the witness because hes the one who chose to do all these transactions with him. And you know, obviously that doesnt work all the time, but there are lots of people in prison on the testimony of people who are a lot worse than michael coe switching because i mean, if im a juror sitting on this and just seeing the cavalcade of the ami people, the pecker, the Michael Cohen. All these people, the amount of sort of just sleazy amount yeah. But but that is the milieu that donald trump has been living in his entire life. Basically, it seems like these are the people hes federalizing with. And in many both sexually and socially allegedly alleged and yeah. And theres so much crosspollination every which way with all of these witnesses and all the various stories, you dont even Keith Davidson was asked about the access Hollywood Tape for incident. It was very interesting because the prosecution use Keith Davidson to point out that there was a shift when the access Hollywood Tape came out, steinglass, the prosecutor asks, what impact if any, did the release of the access Hollywood Tape have on interests in the Stormy Daniels story so far as you are aware, davidson says, so far as im aware, it had tremendous influence. Steinglass asked, can you explain that a little bit to the jury, please . Davidson says before yes. Before Access Hollywood, there was very little if any interests from what i understand in jena, Jena Rodriguez was trying to sell the Stormy Daniels donald trump story. It wasnt until Access Hollywood that interests reached a crescendo. Does it matter . Do you think for jurors that the former president and i dont know if its it probably hasnt been an admitted yet into evidence, but i assume prosecutors will at some point somehow that the former president denies even knowing these two women, Karen Mcdougal and Stormy Daniels. And youve already had david pecker saying multiple times that trump would repeatedly ask, hows our girl karen and even showed that Black And White photo of them walking in the white house. And according to david pecker, at the time that photo was taken, trump has asking her aac, hows karen doing and david peckers answering . I mean, does that does that if he lied about that, would as a juror, would that impact the way they said the former president s sure. This is important exactly. The reason they had that cspan witness and the Court Reporter was because theyre starting to show prosecutors are starting to show the Jury Videotapes of donald trump saying, i dont know these people who are these people . Well and thats powerful for prosecutors because we dont know if donald trump is going to take the stand. Im still on. No. Firmly know. But you still want the jurors to hear his voice, especially when hes lying. Now, its not the ultimate end issue, but you want the jurors hearing him lying about what he knows about these people because you say, why would you lie about this if he had nothing to hide, why would you lie about this . Fortnight, its the worst when youre a Criminal Defense Attorney you cant cross examined it, right . Its your guy. Its a tape or film or video. Its real. And youre like, wow so in one situation where i was confronted with this and it was really horrible evidence and summation, i just took every single word and broke it down and try to play the source within and try to change the definition of what the person was actually saying. But anderson, it is when youre aiming, there were times when your Defense Attorney, you just said, oh, jeez how am i what am i going to do here . What am i . Especially when your client goes out of the courtroom and berates the judge and then you gotta go in and youre the lawyer the next day hes got to deal with them. Do you wanna see oh, i was just going to say that the were showing that trump is a liar, liar, pants on fire. And one of the old sayings is everybody cant be lie at a certain point. Yeah. Yeah. Good. Take it for what its worth more head on. The history made in courts today. Coming up next though the latest from Columbia University, where the school is Emergency Management team just send out a text to students telling them to quote, shelter in place. Well have lab reports ahead. I hear that music and my feature start tapping my grandchildren, their sixth generation of dancers what my familys all about i thought i knew a lot about are irish roots. I was surprised to learn so many more things from an said thats 391892. And heres the boat. They came over on. I think there was a julia healy and mary healy. This is her name. Yeah wow so its to playoffs. What brings you to adhere to are you looking at do you really have to ask missile says, look, i know it can be stressful. This tab, a year, a great teammates build each other up. They trust at the other will be there for them when they were gonna do a trust walls and you close your eyes for trust what you sent me up doc i told you, imagine a future where plastic is not wasted. But instead remade over and over into the things that keep our food fresher. Our family safer and our planet cleaner to help us get there americas plastic makers are investing billions of dollars to create Innovative Products and new Recycling Technologies for sustainable change. Because when you push for smarter solutions, week things can happen when youre the leader is after clean up and restoration. 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After new yorks mayor told protesters who took over school building, quote, this month plus to n now, short time ago, cnn reporters saw the arrival in new York Police Departments Strategic Response unit outside columbias campus on broadway, where the whole area has been shut down several reports now, starting with our miguel marquez, miguel, explain where you are and what youre seeing were at 114th and broadways would have just down from the main gates of columbia. Want to show you whats happening here. Thats a massive number of Police Officers who are now moving in with the helmets, with the bats as well. And they are lining up on the east side of broadway nearest the university whats the mayor and nypd has said all day is that they needed permission from colombia to do this. Clearly, they have worked out a plan and they are waiting for that permission and our mark morales tells us that nypd says are columbia says that they will be sending that permission that letter for them to move in on both the encampment in the main lawn of columbia and into Hamilton Hall, where protesters broke into overnight and have been hanging banners throughout the day. One of them said intifada, which the white house itself released a statement saying that thats not a peaceful thing to do. And said it was antisemitic and terrible rhetoric for those new here at 1 14, i do want to say you cant if you could just come around this way, there is a small number of protestors here who have been chanting at police who are, who have shut off one 14 but the main road, the police the Police Officers in front of us are keeping this road shut. But the main brunt of Police Officers who have the helmets and theyre bats and our on broadway now, the closest way into where the encampment is, just down one 14, there are gates there that they would be able to get through the bookstore for columbia. Can if you could just turn up broadway here. Thats one 15th might up there. The bookstore is just up there theres another way into the campus there thats a direct access to where the encampment is we expect that we will see Police Moving in and several these areas. We were up at one 16th and broadway, which is the main entrance to columbia earlier. And that entrance, its completely shut down. There was a large number of protesters there early they marched up broadway. Its not clear what theyre is marching two other protesters have stayed on the Amsterdam Sayyed on the other side of campus is another big main gate there protesters are there, but thats nearest to where the building they take over as but it looks like all of the activity. And were police will go through is in here im looking over here. It does look like police are bringing in even more barricades for hours and hours today, theyve been bringing in these barricades to shut down broadway. Broadway shutdown both north and south is an extraordinary move by police are shut down this major intersection. So they clearly have been working on this plan for some time. Its just a matter of having that legal okay. To do it. And it sounds like that is coming very who are on the campus. The only people who can be on the campus are Essential Workers or students students say theres nothing happening on campus right now. Its very tense, but they are waiting like everybody else, anderson, miguel marquez, stay right there. Well come back to you. Cnn reported Julia Vargas Jones is on the other side of the Gates On Campus Outside Hamilton Hall that is currently being occupied really explain what the scene is there, like right now and show us around sure. Anderson. We are right outside Hamilton Hall. Im going to step way so you can have a better sense of the scene. This is the building that protests theres had been occupying for almost 20 hours now, theres a human chain thats been formed by others supporters of these students and just as there are inside of Hamilton Hall, their aim is not let police get to protesters that are inside the barricade or you can see this pulley system anderson, theyre putting things in this water thats been going up and down all day. Ive been here since about six in the morning and i could only get in because i am a student at the time, students were allowed on campus at this point only if you live on campus or jareh essential worker, like you said, can actually be here or enter. Theres very few people on campus feeling, as i spoke to students three undergraduate students, one of them jewish, about the feeling of being caught inbetween and what is down to be a standoff this all around here all of these are dorms. People live here students live here theyre just, you can see, people are just watching from their windows waiting to see what happens. One of them said, you know, we are waiting to see the new York Police Department come in now, rest are potentially some of our classmates. Obviously, we dont know who is inside the building. We know that there was a lot of violence that happened to get into it, but some of them the hearing, our students are affiliated with columbia and the big question is, what will the university do so let me ask you, julia it looks like, it looks like theres about maybe i dont know, 50 students or people. I dont know if theyre all students. Some of them are masked and hiding their identities standing outside this door. Do you have any idea how many people are actually inside the building are barricaded inside . Yes. Anderson has been really difficult to get information from the protesters because they wont talk to the media. So what i have heard and trying to speak to them is a few dozen perhaps a couple of protesters are inside. You can see them up there. You can see them up on the balcony like some of the folks but stormed the building yesterday at about wealth 30 yesterday, by the way, there was also a human chain that was formed by other supporters to try and keep them in there all day. Theyre having people coming in and out and chanting and trying to in trying to prevent anyone else from getting in is you may or may are adams and Police Officials said late today that they believe outside actors have coopted or been involved with the protest there on campus. I know some like, experienced Protest Organizers have been seen on campus. Theres videos of that. What, if anything, have you seen or heard people say about that again, some of these people are masked. So its very hard to identify who they actually are yeah, and theres i mean, youre touching on the point people dont want us to know theyre identity. Those were going to interview someone i asked them their first and last name. None of that is being shared with us. And you know, im im a student, i am a member of the columbia community. Even even i am not trusted by some of the organizers here. So its really difficult to get that kind of information on what we see. So we have been trying to be here as much as possible to see and witness and i have been here all day, but this because, all we can see, i dont know who the agitators are that i know that there have been reports of that. I dont know also because all of these people are inside, theyve been coming out there thanking the food and the support and in thats it. Thats all of the window that we have. And then we see the mood from other students is basically just they feel caught in the middle. They feel like the administration has committed some mistakes in escalating the situation by allowing new York Police Department to come in and arrest more than 100 students about two weeks ago when the situation was not so dire. And at the same time, they think that this is an escalation on the part of the protesters for a student thats just tried to the class. This is finals week where a couple of weeks away from graduation, im supposed to graduate. We have no idea what is going to happen it is obviously a huge disruption in also changes the mood on camera. Its not just the logistics. Its pitting people. Its dividing people and putting people against each other. Anderson, there were reports on some College Campuses of professors, people teaching classes suggesting classes be onscene of protests in order to show solidarity with protesters. Have you heard of that at at columbia at all . And im wondering how that kind of thing is received to what degree are faculty involved in encouraging there had been members of faculty and staff after that were for example, in the human chain that was formed around last night . Yes. I didnt see that. I wasnt here, but those are the reports that i heard from students that were here and there are classes be held off campus. So all classes we move to parts roles so its like colombia has been doing, but some professors have wanted to have students meet because it is a time of heightened tensions and it makes sense that people want to be together to also figured out them process all of it. Like i said, people have been pitted against each other for backing each other into corners. So so thing that dialogue might be important for the community too. Eventually become to heal which things so far from the possibility right now yeah. I mean, i went to college in the 80s. There were a lot of antiapartheid protests and the camp meant on the campus where i went to school at yale. But it didnt pitt students against each other. There werent you know, im sure there was a lot of disagreements, but there wasnt this kind of animosity in these incidents of of hostility between shouting matches between students. Thats got to be really distressing and we saw right at the beginning of the protests, we saw israel flags and us flags being flown right next to palestinian flags and people in coffee is in a traditional Palestinian Scarf its difficult to observe that and just to think, how do you move forward . How can you actually come to a solution here is standing outside of m two what is going to happen, how these students are removed tonight by by nypd, what the sentiment of all the other supporters. Of course, im sure that many people will be revealed to not have essentials on campus. But how how do we go back to normal . I think thats the question, that the university isnt really addressing. Yet. It doesnt seem like theres a plan. Now im speaking to you as a student. I havent heard a plan of how do we move forward from this. I mean, for me, i graduate all along with the other 15,000 people that are supposed to graduate in a couple of weeks, which by the way a commencement structures already been set up in the lawn right across from here. Clearly, thats whats on the mind of the university, but i dont now what happens in the people form now years like columbia Julia Vargas Jones. Thank you. Stay with us. If you can. I please stay there. And if you could keep that camera live. If youre able to on the people behind you, that would be great. Charles ramsey, a former Police Commissioner and Philadelphia Police chief of washington, dc, joins us now commissioner, i mean, just from a policing standpoint, does the ordered to shelter in place from the university to students signal to you that something may happen imminently absolutely it does. I mean, youre trying to keep as many students away from that location as possible. I mean, this action is overdue in my opinion, the university has been very slow in responding or whats going on. Theres no longer a peaceful protests forced their way into the building. Done damage inside that building its time for this to stop in nypd will be making entry once they get permission from the university obviously therell be some confrontation there. People in there had been already worn and told to leave. They refuse to leave. I imagine a barricaded doors first. And so forth. But the police will have to get them out of there as well as dismantle the encampment as weve said, and seen, in, is reporting a hundreds of officers from the nypds Strategic Response team or outside columbias campus tonight. I know youre seeing the i believe youre seeing the images that we are seeing on the lefthand side of this greene and Police Officers, they have a riot helmets on it looks like they probably have im not sure what else they would have on them what kind of a Response Unit is that . Do you know . Well i mean, most large departments have something very similar to that dc we called a cdu civil disturbance units. These are officers that are specially trained for Crowd Control and events. So that theyre called, theyre all over the city. It brought him you cant just strip anyone district because you still have 911 calls. The answer sure. So theres a plan on how many people to bring in from the various districts and divisions they have throughout new york city theyre going to have a significant presence. There to take care of this. In fact, you always try to have an overwhelming presence. It really does keep down the possibility of people getting injured. Now, the officers have their full gear on because theyre gonna get hit with projectiles. Theres absolutely no question in my mind about that. This is not going to be easy and its not going to look very pretty, but theyre gonna get it done they will use whatever force they have to use, but itll be proportional. But it will not look good, but they will get it done in this should have been done a couple of days ago at least a couple of days ago, universitys been behind the curve on this from the beginning. Yeah. I mean, just from a tactical concern, the fact that the you have people inside that building had been there all day and people outside passing them things. I mean, weve just seen a bucket with whatever going being on a rope going up to them and the reporter on scene was saying that thats been going on all day if somebody inside wanted to have projectiles, they could throw at Law Enforcement as they approach, they seem to have had time to have stuff brought in if that is what they have we know we dont know what their intentions are theres a Law Enforcement source at official and a lot Enforcement Official tells cnn that they believe at least half of the demonstrators are not affiliated with the university, would that surprise you . I mean, how would that change the calculus for a potential Law Enforcement response it does not surprise me at all. In fact, id be surprised with majority worst but once they get in there to people who are not students need to be arrested, charged with trespassing, damage to property and any students that are part of that, in my opinion, should be expelled from the university. You have to make a strong statement. I mean, this is not unlike january 6 where theyd you just bum rush your way into a building, just forcibly take it over . You cant do that. That is part of the protests that i have seen over the years. And then fact that i have benefited from in my career, but not been for the civil rights protests of the 50s and 60s. I never would observe as Police Commissioner and affiliate or Washington Dc i dont i appreciate protests, but lawful protest that what youre seeing here, this is not lawful. Its got to stop. They got to take the action and they will take it it is ensuring chief ram sam and i was looking up, its from the history of protests and columbia and in the 60s against the war in vietnam, you did have buildings being occupied and in some cases, Even School Officials being held are not allowed to leave those buildings that were being occupied by students in negotiations would take place. I think that was the last time that police were actually called on to the campus bother you . Firstly, i think in 68 to respond to some of that well, ive started my Policing Career in chicago in 1968, late 1968, became a sworn member and 71. So i was part of the group that had to deal with a lot of the vietnam war protests, which got pretty violent at times. And so ive seen it and ive seen how these things its going to spin out of control. And this is a perfect example of something that is really spun out of control. It started off as a peaceful protests obviously there were issues antisemitism and things like that that should not be taking place but it was relatively peaceful, but it didnt take long before you get outside agitators that attach themselves to legitimate protesters out, ill call other just there because they do believe in a particular cause. The other folks are there to cause problems. And thats what you have right here. And so youre going to see when they finally get the word to go in and they will go in and they will clear that building. It will clear that encampment, but its going to take all night probably to really get it done. It chief ramsey, hold on for us. I want to bring in also as we continue to look at these images, the splitscreen of the hall thats occupied, you see other demonstrators outside forming a line and then you obviously you see the growing Police Gathering outside. I want to bring in stephanie rawlings, blake, former Baltimore Mayor, whos sitting here with us. Marys. You are watching this, im sure you have dealt. I use certainly dealt with all the demonstrations in baltimore and even im sure the occupation and buildings what do you see . What what are the things jump out at you . Its a little triggering because you see what i know is happening when you have these instances the what the, what the main thing is no longer the main thing like what the moral test that people are are fighting for is being taken over by outside protesters that i think mockery of what many of the students are standing up for a lot of this is pro palestine, but also antiwar people are very upset about the amount of of loss of life. But when you, when you take over the building you lose that, youre losing the moral high ground. I have to ask myself, when is that worked . When you destroy property and takeover the building like that. So i think these outside protestors are coopting what could have been a useful all productive conversation about columbias participation in israel. And i think a lot of that just lost because of the way that this has really gone off track. Were going to continue to monitor the situation around Columbia University, bring you any developments as they happen. It seems like something may be happening soon. Were obviously going to bring to you live. Were going to also return to todays trial and more of the contest and wales between judge marchand and the former president and faces the possibility of jail if he continues to violate the judges gag order, well be right back. Every the piece of evidence tells a story how would really happen jesse. Oh, martin, sundays at nine on cnn from Meat Free Monday to sizzle pans sunday so many ways to save life ready while it happy, thats 3605 by Whole Foods Market sail through the heart of historic cities and unforgettable scenery with faking, unpack once, and get closer to iconic landmarks local life, and Cultural Treasures because when you experienced europe on a viking long ship, you will spend less time getting there and more time being that viking exploring the world in comfort so as we continue to monitor developments at Columbia University were also bringing special continuing coverage of trumps hush money trial. The first criminally charged us president. Now also the first to be held in Criminal Contempt for multiple violations of the Gag Order Nine to be exact, out of ten online post in question, judge Juan Merchan Making that ruling this morning after taking a week to mold over trumps punishment for attacking expect to trial witnesses and others. One 1,000 for each violation. The maximum thats 9,000 in total for now, theres another hearing scheduled thursday for four more additional alleged violations meantime, the form president is responded online posting. This judge has taken away my constitutional right to free speech. And the only president ial candidate in history to be gagged is only write on the latter, but thats a result of his own actions. And if he keeps breaking the judges rules, it could get worse quoting the judge. Now, defendant is hereby warn that the court will not tolerate continued willful violations of its lawful orders, and that if necessary, it will impose are incarcerate tori punishment i want to go to miguel mark it looks like the police may be moving in a columbia. Lets go back, miguel, what are you seeing were i can hear you. I can hear you can you hear me . Yeah. I got you now so on broadway, police have just moved us over to another location on broadway. You can see a large number of police, but theyve just brought in many, many, dozens more. You can see actually theyre coming back ford us now dozens and dozens of Police Officers with the riot helmets, with their pitons and with the flexi cuffs, moving down one 14 toward broadway. Now, they just move down this way the closest you can get to where the encampment is, if he would come over here can is just down here all the way down. One 14 on sort of the middle of the block between amsterdam and broadway thats the closest you can get. That seems to be where police are setting up in the largest numbers. It seems that police here can actually come over here. This is actually interesting so police are both on the streets. Theyre also on the sidewalk because a lot of this is Student Housing in here and students have come out to see whats happening on this side. There was a small not of protesters on one 14 on that side. Its a very chaotic situation, but it does sound like columbia, which clearly had had it with the protesters once they didnt leave after the deadline yesterday at 2 00 p. M. And then took over a Hamilton Hall theyve been working with nypd today. Clearly just to sort this out, we expect that at any moments they will have the Legal Authority from Columbia University in the form of a letter asking nypd to come in and asking the police to come in and clear the protesters. This is interesting. So this is a building across the street from columbia and police are now making entry into that building. Its not clear whats happening. Officer, do you know whats happening here . Why are they going in that building . So it sounds like this may have been a situation where students come out of a dorm, mixed it up with police and then police are now moving into that building to try to keep those crowds from hustling them. This was filled just a few minutes ago. This was filled this 100143 here filled with students and it is police have now moved everybody out back into their dorms and off the streets here. So clearly they are, its one more step they are taking to lock down this entire area before they move into Columbia University proper, to clear both the encampment. Yeah. And Hamilton Hall and the girl holding well let us know if any of the thing develops. I would quick i want to get our shimon prokupecz, who is nearby your location, but just a different vantage point. She tell us where you are, what youre seeing so were on broadway, anderson were action in an area where its completely frozen, but weve been able to stay here because of the business here. Weve been on their property because the police several times have asked us to move. So were able to stay here. Whats going on here is you have a group of protesters that have gathered here on 113th and Broadway Police have been making several announcements for them to disperse, to leave. And so far they have not moved into make any arrests, but significant here, anderson has if you look at the shot that we have up here now, those are the search teams. They were some of the first officers to respond here i would expect him to meet some of the first officers inside the encampment they are lining up. They were here earlier aligning up. They left to go deal with Something Else and they have since come back. They have been discussing the strategy, the planning here. Their chief telling them when you go inside, put your advisors down, because we expect to get things thrown at us. Hey, miguel, what youre also seeing, some of these other let me just quickly ask you, were seeing on the righthand side of her skin, were seeing your shot in the lefthand side and the righthand side, were also seeing one of the columbia gates with protesters sort of on top of it looking in are those do you know where that is and it that near you . And are those protesters who are not able to get onto campus because theyre not students i dont really want to be where they know anderson. Okay. I dont know if thats for me, but i dont know where that is. Okay. Sorry. You continue with what youre saying. I dont know where that is yeah. So the officers that are gathered here, it appears that theyre here more to sort of protect the perimeter because were seeing people arrive here protesters in the area. There are barricades everywhere, and officers just keep continuing to arrive. I mean, this is such a massive response and now youre seeing here more surge. Theyre moving in anderson now, were seeing the Surge Officers here. Move forward. The other officers are now moving forward. We could see them moving were trying to get through some of these vehicles here that are blocking us with the police appear to be moving were trying to get a sense of exactly where theyre moving to its not entirely clear so he shimon, can you tell what street youre on . So im now on one 14 and broadway. And it seems the officers here, were trying to not get thrown out of here in the sense, okay so let me just tell you, or reviewers shimon that the gate were seeing on the shimon on the lefthand side of your screen is at one 14th and broadway. What youre seeing on the righthand side of your screen, thats another entrance to columbia gate. Thats been closed protesters cannot get into i assume because theyre not students identities are being checked. That gate is at one 16th in Amsterdam Avenue thats an, uh, different sayyed of columbia. Go ahead. Shimon, continue to tell us what youre seeing right . So