Transcripts For CNNW CNN 20240702

a rare face-to-face between the leaders of two global powers. moments from now president biden and china's president xi meet on u.s. soil amid rising tensions. can they reset relations? plus, israeli troops raid gaza's largest hospital after claiming hamas is using it as a terror cell. will the idf show evidence as hamas and hospital officials deny this? where are patients supposed to go? an emergency hearing in fulton county, georgia. why the district attorney says they need to seal evidence in the case against former president donald trump and others. all these stories coming in right here to "cnn news central." ♪ ♪ at any moment president biden and chinese president xi jinping are set to meet face-to-face for the first time in a year. president biden is hoping this highly-anticipated meeting will put the u.s./china relationship on steadier footing. the president has been lowering expectations heading into it. the summit is taking place in san francisco. cnn's dana colbert joins us now with more. what is the expectation for what will come out of this meeting? >> reporter: it's an important part and first step in something that hasn't happened in a year between these two leaders. both president xi and president biden arrived at the estate just south of san francisco and this is where they'll have a discussion that could last about four hours. as far as the agenda items, depends on who you ask. we get much more transparency on the u.s. side. president biden says it's about making things normal again and re-establishing military communication. this has been severed since two summers ago. it's an important and crucial time given how highly contested the south china sea is right now. that's a priority on the u.s. side. as far as china is concerned, we don't hear from president xi directly ahead of events. that's how the chinese handle things. they'll put a read-out on the back end. we can look at what china needs, which is a boost in their economy. look for something that would be economy related that could benefit china, perhaps easing pressure on chinese businesses to allow that boost to take place, which allows for social stability within china which is crucial for the chinese communist party. >> president biden hinted china's economy isn't doing so great. china wouldn't come to the table unless it was going to get something from the u.s. in this meeting. for the u.s. part, you know, it's -- look, there likely won't be a joint statement that is customary. at the end of the day is this just about preventing tensions from spiraling further out of control between the u.s. and china? >> reporter: strange to think how much lower we could go between these two countries, but, yeah, it's about cooling intentions. that's a priority for president biden if anything to avoid a u.s./china conflict. he wants to refocus on israel and hamas as well as russia and ukraine and focus energies on the 2024 campaign. china and their struggling economy, it's critical for them to figure out how to survive through what's been an incredible downfall in recent years. they'll be looking for any sort of aspect that could help them boost that. that's also going to include meeting with business leaders here in san francisco. >> that's right. tell us more about that. what can you tell us about that? it's worth reminding viewers that president xi actually studied in iowa about 40 years ago. he's going to be meeting with i i iowans as well in california. >> reporter: yes. he's calling on old friends from iowa. he's got ties here in san francisco. his first visit to the united states was in 1985. he was a communist party official, not as high as he is now having secured a third term. this meeting with business leaders, that's going to be interesting. it's already proved to be very polarizing here in the u.s. what china needs is to woo these business leaders, particularly american companies back into china. what we've seen in the past couple years is these companies have been dissuaded from doing business in china, in part because of beijing's crackdowns on companies. they're hesitant and concerned about getting profit out of china back into the u.s. these are things that need to be discussed. there's a big welcome xi dinner, if you will, that's planned after this one-on-one with president biden and president xi. that has drawn concern from lawmakers, one many particular, the chairman of the house select committee that focusing on the ccp, mike galalagher. he called this unconscionable. there's a price tag for business leaders to attend this dinner. in some cases it's been reported to be $40,000. he wants to know what companies are involved and who will be going to this dinner. >> okay, thanks. breonna? israeli troops carrying out a raid at gaza's largest hospital. the israeli forces claim they found concrete evidence that hamas was using this hospital as a command mode. doctors at al-shifa have denied such claims. israel and the u.s. said intel indicated hamas did, indeed, have operational infrastructure at the hospital. cnn's jeremy diamond is in israel. jeremy, we haven't yet seen the evidence from israel. >> reporter: that's right, breonna. the idf just started to share some video evidence, showing inside the hospital that there are ak-47s, ammunition, go bags placed in different parts of the al-shifa complex. they show an mri center at the hospital and say they found a bag behind the mri machine. there's no way to independently verify the veracity of these claims. we obviously were not able to be with israeli troops as they uncover this -- these weapons and ammunition. the idf is saying this points to clear evidence that hamas was using al-shifa hospital to carry out its operations. they're not yet revealing whether they found any tunnel entrances to that massive underground complex, which not only israeli officials but u.s. officials have said they believe, based on their intelligence, exists below al-shifa hospital. israeli troops are continuing to operate at the hospital at this hour. it's not clear how much longer they intend to stay there. i had a briefing with a senior israeli defense forces official who told me there were no battles between troops and hamas militants on the al-shifa complex, but as they arrived at the complex they killed four hamas militants on the outside of that very large hospital complex. we also know and what is clear is that thousands of people were at al-shifa hospital when israeli troops entered. they gave doctors about a half hour notice before they arrived to carry out this operation, to carry out these searches. that includes doctors and patients, but also thousands of displaced gazans who have been sheltering on the hospital grounds. a reporter inside the hospital told our colleagues he heard heavy gunfire battles across the hospital yard over the night and that they also saw tanks and armored personnel carriers and a large number of troops at the hospital. what's also clear is there are still patients at this hospital and the conditions are precarious, including for those premature babies, which the whole world has seen at this point. israeli forces say as part of this operation they delivered incubators and other medical supplies to the al-shifa hospital. we can't independently confirm when those supplies were delivered. at this hour the director of gaza's hospital says those premature babies are in severe danger and that evacuating them right now is very, very difficult. breonna? >> it's essential, though, as we've seen. jeremy you're there and you're very close to northern gaza. what are you seeing? >> reporter: well, what's interesting is that yesterday the israeli defense minister said israeli forces were in total control of the gaza strip, that hamas lost its grip on the northern part of the gaza strip, focusing above gaza city. what we've been witnessing not only overnight as the operation was happening in gaza city early this morning and this evening, is intense battles between israeli forces and hamas militants in the area behind me. it appears to be around the refugee camp. we saw explosions and tracer fire being shot and intense gun battles happening in two directions between hamas militants and israeli forces. even as israeli forces push deeper into the gaza strip, deeper into gaza city, they're also still very much dealing with the threat of hamas militants in the northern part of the strip. part of that may have to do with the tunnel systems that hamas has. we know israeli forces told us repeatedly over the last several weeks that ambushes are one of the most serious threats they face as they operate inside gaza. >> extremely dangerous operations there. jeremy diamond, thank you so much. we have nada bashir in jerusalem. strong condemnations coming from the u.n. about this hospital raid. what can you tell us? >> reporter: there have been repeated calls from the u.n. and other human rights groups for civilians to be the primary concern here. this is a hospital that still holds hundreds of patients. there's concern around their security. we continue to see bombardment around the vicinity of the al-shifa hospital. the situation uninside the hospital has been deteriorating. this is one of the majority hospitals in northern gaza. it's not operational. they don't have enough medical supplies or fuel to keep the generators going. we've seen oxygen supplies in the neonatal unit cut off at the al-shifa hospital. huge concern around the capability for doctors to provide the urgent care needed by so many patients inside the al-shifa hospital. we've heard the repeated calls for civilians to evacuate from northern gaza to southern gaza. as we know, it's extremely difficult for patients to evacuate through that route. >> certainly is. just a snapshot of the humanitarian crisis. nada, thank you so much for that. pam? president biden just about to arrive for his meeting with chinese president xi jinping. m.j. lee is standing by for us. m.j., the united states is rolling out the red carpet for president xi. everything has been so carefully choreographed leading up to this meeting, right? >> reporter: yeah, and that is very much expected given that the stakes could not be higher for both leaders. we have heard that both leaders have arrived at this historic estate. any minute we should be seeing pictures of the two leaders shaking hands. just to give you some context here, of course the last time that the two leaders met face-to-face was about a year ago on the sidelines of the g20 summit in bali. you think about everything that's transpired over the last year where the two countries' relationship has deteriorated. there was the issue of the chinese surveillance balloon shot down. there was the issue of former speaker nancy pelosi visiting taiwan which angered beijing officials. that ultimate ended up leading to the military to military communications between the two countries being severed. we're told behind the scenes in their conversations that they've had with their chinese counterparts, u.s. officials for months have been pressing them to consider re-establishing that communication, which they say is so critical to making sure there's not any unnecessary misunderstandings between the two countries. we're told they used the example of the surveillance balloon as an example of why that communication being open is so important. as we were talking about before, that is just one of the few tangible outcomes that u.s. officials hope to see coming out of this summit which should be beginning any moment. >> we're expecting the two leaders of the two super powers to arrive any moment. when they met a year ago in bali, the goal was to establish a floor and ahead of this meeting administration officials are trying to temper expectations, right, m.j.? >> reporter: in terms of specific outcomes, pam, yes. as we have been talking to u.s. officials heading into the summit, they said, we have a big picture goal. that's to bring u.s./china relations back to a new normal, whatever that might be. that's about establishing those lines of communication, making sure that there are diplomatic conversations having so that, even though the two countries are competitors and have plenty of areas where they disagree, they can work together on areas where there are -- areas where they can work together, but also just to make sure there aren't any unnecessary, pricey back-them-up between the two countries. >> m.j., i'm going to interrupt you. we're seeing the two leaders meet in this remarkable moment. president biden and president xi meeting ahead of this high-stakes meeting. >> that's right. very big day here as they're meeting. this is a very dramatic place where they're meeting, sending a signal how important this is. they haven't met here. there hasn't been a meeting for several years as they go inside the estate between san jose and san francisco. this is on the sidelines of the apex summit this year. there are so many topics to cover as we're joined by evan and matthew. we were just talking about gaza. one of the things they're supposed to touch on is, you know, leaning on china to lean on iran to lean on its proxies to not provoke a further situation in the middle east as israel and hamas is battling it out. do you think china's going to be receptive to that? what's that going to look like as biden is asking that of xi? >> you saw in the body language right there, this is a solemn occasion. this was not a particularly amo amorous, friendly encounter. this is business. they got right into it. they walked into the door. we'll hear more from them in a few hours. china has leverage when it comes to iran. they're iran's biggest consumer for energy. they buy 1 million barrels of oil a day. the united states is saying to iran, look, you're in a position to get iran to change its behavior, but we want you to understand we expect you to use your leverage when you can. a meeting like this is important face-to-face because we don't know what kind of information xi jinping is getting from the people around him. in a regular government where you know the foreign minister will speak to the president, then you can give your message to the foreign minister. in this case you have to give it directly to xi. >> matthew, big picture for our viewers, how significant is this meeting? why should everyone care about these two leaders meeting right now? >> the united states and china are the two -- the world's two biggest super powers, the two largest economies on earth. there's a fear the united states and china could go to war over taiwan. xi has asked the people's liberation army to give him the ability to invade taiwan by 2027. the biden administration is trying to put guardrails on the relationship, trying to find areas for cooperation, communication. i'm skeptical they'll fully succeed. i'm skeptical to the previous question that china's going to help the united states solve its problems, but it's important to have this channel for dialogue. >> right, because so much of the relationship between china and russia and china and iran is hatred toward the u.s., right? >> at its core the relationship xi jinping has with vladimir putin is about the fact that they're the two leaders who are standing up to the united states. there was a telling moment a few months ago when xi visited putin at the kremlin. it was caught on camera. you heard xi say, there are changes in the world, the likes of which we haven't seen in a century, and you and i are leading the charge. putin said, i agree. that's what the united states -- that's the lock we're trying to pick to some degree. we're trying to say to xi, yes, we know where you lined up for new, but there's this larger concept where we expect -- if you want to be treated like russia, we'll treat you like russia. >> new world order is what they're talking about. we're looking at this meeting. it's been rocky. if it goes off the rails, what does the world order look like? what do we reflect on this meeting? >> i think it's a imagine inflection point. i think the old world order is over. i think this could be a decades long competition between the united states and its allies in the free world and china who is increasingly working with iran, russia and north korea. i think this is going to be a contentious relationship for decades to come. >> i think -- when we talk about a summit, that term came from winston churchill in 1950. he talked about high-altitude meetings with the soviets. his idea was you have to go to the top and you have to talk to them. he said, it's better to meet jaw to jaw than go to war. this is a meeting to say let's just keep talking because the alternative is unattractive. >> that happens. don't worry. >> for historical context, when xi jinping has met with past presidents, trump, obama, commitments were made. what happened? >> well in a bigger historical context, xi is a different type of chinese leader. the united states tried to engage china for many decades after the end of the cold war with some success. xi decided he's taking the relationship in a different direction and wants to compete with the united states. he has let us down in the past. he told obama he wasn't going to militarize the south china sea and then he did that. he told trump he was going to work on fentanyl and china is dishonest on other issues. it lies about genocide. it lies about its gdp numbers. we have to take anything agreed upon with a grain of salt. >> do they understand each other, these two leaders? >> they spent a lot of time together. i was living in beijing when biden came over the first time and met with him. they went out on this buddy comedy road trip. they went across china and then xi came to the united states and visited in los angeles. biden came back and said to his advisers and said, this man doesn't have a democratic bone in his body and we've got our hands full with this guy. biden understands how xi jinping regards himself than different as the guys before. >> for the meeting this week, look, this time of year -- about a year and a day ago we met in bali on the sidelines of the g20. since then, key members of our teams have had important discussions on issues that matter to both our nations and to the world. as always, there's no substitute to face-to-face discussions. i've always found our discussions to be straightforward and frank and always appreciated them. mr. president, we've known each other for a long time. we haven't always agreed, which wouldn't surprise anyone. our meetings have always been candid, straightforward and useful. never doubted what you told me. i value our conversation because i think it's paramount that you and i understand each other clearly leader to leader with no misconceptions or miscommunication. we have to ensure that competition does not veer into conflict and we have to manage responsibly that competition. that's what the united states wants and what we intend to do. i believe that's also what the world wants from both of us, candid exchange. we have a responsibility to our people and the world to work together when we see it in our interests to do so. the critical global changes we face from climate change, narcotics to artificial intelligence demand us to work together. i welcome you. the floor is yours, mr. president. again, welcome back. >> translator: mr. president, good morning. coming here i thought of -- i think of your trip to china when i was the vice president of china. we had a meeting. it was 12 years ago. i still remember our interactions very vividly and it always gives me a lot of thoughts. last time we met in bali, you said it was a year and a day ago. a lot has happened since then. the world has emerged from the covid pandemic, but is still under its tremendous impacts. the global economy is recovering, but it's momentum remains sluggish. industrial and supply chains are still under the threat of interruption. all these are grave problems. the china/u.s. relationship which is the most important bilateral relationship in the world should be perceived and envisioned in a broad context of the accelerating global transformations seen in a century. they should develop in a way that benefits our two peoples and human progress. the china/u.s. relationship has never been smooth sailing and always faces problems of one kind or another. yet it has kept moving forward amidst twists and turns. for china and the united states turning their back on each other is not an option. it's unrealistic and conflict and confrontation as repercussions for both sides. planet earth is big enough for the two countries to succeed. one country's success is an opportunity for the other. it is an objective fact that china and the united states are different in history, culture, social system and developing path. however, as long as they respect each other, co-exist in peace and pursue cooperation, they will be fully capable of rising above differences and find the right way for the countries to get along. i believe in a promising future of the bilateral relationship. mr. president, you and i, we are at the helm of china/u.s. relations. we shoulder heavy responsibilities for the world and for history. i look forward to having an in-depth exchange of views and reach new understandings with you on overarching issues that are critical and on major issues affecting world peace and development. i wish to -- i wish to thank you for your thoughtful arrangements for our meeting today. thank you. >> thank you, mr. president. >> thanks, press. >> thanks, guys. >> we are walking out. we're going to start walking out. >> thank you so much. it's time to go out. >> you can head out that way. >> we just heard president biden and president xi jinping speak at the summit right outside san francisco. both leaders wanted to convey their messages. you heard the president of china saying conflict would be unbearable between china and the u.s. he said the china/u.s. relationship is the most important bilateral relationship in the world. you heard president biden for his part say it's important to talk. he said he valued the candid, frank, straightforward conversations he's had with xi and he says that's important to avoid any misconception or miscommunication, which i thought was key because, if there is a miscommunication or misconception, that could be as xi jinping put it, unbearable. >> that's the core of this. joe biden likes face to face contact. that's not what this is. this is specific. they don't trust that xi jinping is getting accurate information from the people around him, that the people who are conveying to him what american attitudes are aren't telling him the hard truth. when the united states says it will seek to defend the security of people in taiwan, is that message actually getting to xi jinping. on the same note, when they say they're concerned about the possibility of a real conflict in the south china sea, is that message getting to xi jinping? the word today from joe biden was avoid miscommunication. >> i think what was most striking to me about this is, if you remember the first time the united states and china met after biden's election, it wasn't the top officials, but it was top security advisers. the meeting started off with the united states with a laundry list of complaints for china and china returned the favor on camera. this was a different meeting, more respectful and diplomatic. a change in tone, i think, from the beginning of the administration. >> how do you really find agreement? is it more just about containing the negative? we are talking about two countries who have so many beefs with each other. they're putting on the niceties, yes. there isn't a litany of negatives. from the fentanyl ingredients beginning in china, to concern about chinese interference in elections, not just american elections, but elections around the world to obviously its military stance, to taiwan, to the world order at large. how do you find agreement? >> one of the things that the administration has adopted the concept that conflict is not inevitable with china. they're trying to get us out of the mindset that we're destined to collide. their belief is you can manage the competition. these are two powers that will be competing fiercely in the decades ahead. they're trying to establish a modus operandi so we have an understanding that the united states isn't trying to bring about regime change in beijing. that point needs to be expressed clearly at the highest levels or xi jinping can come to other assum assumptions. >> if you peel back the layers of what was said, what we heard briefly in the summit, both leaders have different outlooks or perceptions of their relationships. >> very much so. china has been hesitant to embrace this idea of a great power competition. they say that sounds too close to the conflict that he described today as unbearable. they're trying to bring it back to an earlier period. xi jinping would love this to be not smooth sailing that he described a moment ago. they are, as matt described, they entered a new era where they have to come up with a new basis for communication. >> if i can jump in. you have to ask why is xi agreeing to this meeting now? part of the reason is they fear maybe the biden administration strategy is working, the derisking economically is hurting the chinese economy. one of the ideas that has been m most successful is building alliances. president biden will be meeting with allies at the apec meeting, japan and south korea, also india, australia. part of the reason china is here is to get out from under the pressure the biden administration has helped to build. >> they're on one side of a line there with their friends and maybe their enemies. i want to get back to m.j. lee who is following the trip of president biden as he's meeting with president xi on the sidelines of the apec summit. are they on the same page where they want this meeting to go, m.j.? >> reporter: breonna, it stood out to me that president biden said that he expected these discussions today to be frank and candid. i think that's language to signal he expects these meetings to be surrounded by tough conversations and tough issues. we already know some of those issues that will come up. u.s. officials want to press their chinese counterparts, for example, on the upcoming elections in taiwan. they want to signal to them, you better not interfere with those elections. we know issues about human rights will come up. we're told president biden in passing is likely to mention the issue of the spy balloon. i think what we're seeing right now is the culmination of a month-long eviffort by u.s. officials to grind down their chinese counterparts and convince them it's to beijing's benefit to re-establish some sort of normalcy back to u.s./china relationships, including the communication ch channels we talked about and an openness to work together and talk together. i think this is not, as you guys have been talking about, two friends who are leaders who are getting tot. they are two leaders of two super power countries that are getting tot to try to resolve some of these differences and fi find rare areas of cooperation. it's going to be a marathon of meetings that will really cover some very tough issues for both countries. >> certainly will be with so many people watching this. m.j. lee live for us there in woodside, california, following this important visit of the president meeting with the chinese president. such an important meeting as we've been talking about. the list of issues they're going to be going through, it has this evident of that standoff before what may be a very long boxing match determining who is going to be the world leader, china or the u.s. it's a question unanswered at this point. this is a faceoff we're seeing. friendly enough right now. does it continue to be? can they find areas of cooperation and avoid some misunderstandings as we've seen these close calls in the south china sea? wewe'll contininue to covever r trip.. we'll bebe right bacack in just momentnt. disaster averted for now. it is clear major obstacles face the house gop as they fail to pass spending bills. after a day of pure chaos, tensions remain high as speaker mike johnson worked with democrats to get the bill passed. one conference member warning johnson, it's strike one and strike two. let's get straight so our capitol hill reporter. melanie, what are you hearing? >> reporter: there were no physical fights today as far as i know. there have been some verbal fights over spending issues. the house passed a bill yesterday to keep the government's lights on temporarily until early next year. that's expected to pass the senate as soon as today. there won't be a government shutdown friday. the house is strulggling to pas their long-term spending bills. today a few moderates and conservatives tanked a bill to fund the commerce and justice departments which prompted gop leadership to send members home early for the thanksgiving recess. conservatives want a clear plan from the new speaker mike johnson for his vision for cutting spending. they said their vote today should serve as a warning shot. let's listen. >> we're standing up and we said no today. the speaker has ten days to work it out. he's promising a fight. we're sending a message. >> the situation is not of his making, but moving forward we expec expect tangible results to move us down the field in the right direction. >> reporter: the honeymoon period appears to be over for the new speaker. he won't lose his gavel over this, but this suggests the next government funding deadlines will be a heavy lift. >> let me ask you something else, melanie. when do we expect the house ethics committee to release its george santos report? >> reporter: i'm told they're planning to release their highly-anticipated report as soon as tomorrow. they've been investigating the congressman since march over a number of issues, including whether he engaged in unlawful activity related to his 2022 congressional campaign. investigators are expected to detail their finding in the report, but not any disciplinary recommendations. any member can force a floor vote on something like expulsion, which they did, but it failed. we could see that expulsion effort, due to that report, succeed. george santos could be the latest member to be expelled. >> that would be a big deal. joining us now is former pennsylvania congressman charlie debb. so you have gop hard liners giving the new speaker of the house johnson ten days to win them over on spending. how do you see this playing out? >> i think the hard liners will be disappointed between now and february 2nd. they're going to write the appropriations bill ts numbers the law. they'll write the bill to that number. what they're doing now is they're writing them to lower numbers that were not agreed to in the law. everybody knows that's a joke. it's a waste of time. when they negotiate with the senate on these spending bills on january 19th and february 2nd, they'll write the numbers into law. the hard liners will hate that because they don't agree with the numbers. it's that simple. >> there's no way he can play with these hard liners? >> no, unless he wants to have rolling shutdowns on january 19th and february 2nd. the speaker did the right thing on the continuing resolution to fund the government. they have to deal with these long-term spending bills. >> you served in the house of representatives. things are always tense. have you ever seen it like this? you heard melanie say at least there wasn't a physical altercation today. >> yeah, that's a good thing. i've seen some tense moments. this has been building up for sometime. when they're in session as long as they are for so many weeks, that capital turns into a pressure cooker and they have to go to release the tension. >> is that part of the reason they're going home earlier? >> absolutely. they took down an appropriations bill today. when you're in the majority party, you're expected to bring up the bill. they're not bringing up the bill. the republicans are killing the speaker's ability to even consider the bill. at that point he threw his hands up in the air and said we have to get them out of town. on the ethics side, it's highly unusual for the ethics committee to give an update on an investigation. they almost never do that. when i was chair, we only released statements when we were about to announce a sanction. >> what do you make of it? >> i think they're under tremendous pressure to show they're making progress on the santos measure because of the expulsion resolution offered next week. they wanted to show they're making progress and doing a real investigation. >> charlie dent, always great to hear your perspective. just ahead, the u.s. repeats its call to israel not to target hospitals from the air. in order for small businesses to thrive, they need to be smart, efficient, savvy. making the most of every opportunity. that's why comcast business is introducing the small business bonus. for a limited time you can get up to a $1000 prepaid card with qualifying internet. yep, $1000. so switch to business internet from the company with the largest fastest reliable network and that powers more businesses than anyone else. learn how you can get $1000 back for your business today. comcast business. powering possibilities. new details including footage will be published later showing what the israeli military claims is, quote, concrete evidence that hamas has used the al shifa hospital as a terr terrorist. the issue is growing increasingly dire during israel's ongoing raid there. doctors are warning of catastrophic conditions for patients and staff, and it is believed that thousands of civilians are sheltering inside. joining us now we have retired army colonel peter mansour who served as executive officer to petreus. colonel, just talk to us about this and, look this is very tricky because you have the idf in this hospital, and they say they are there for good reason, but this is a place with so many vulnerable people and so evidence is so important. the idf is saying they are being precise and they are being targeted in their actions here, is that what you were seeing? >> well, a hospital is protected sanctuary by the laws of war. now it loses that status if the enemy forces use it as a military facility. that's what the israelis are claiming, that hamas has turned this hospital into a command center and, therefore, it's free game for their military forces but they still have a responsibility to protect civilians as they clear the building. it would be best if they evacuate the civilians from the building and they can search it and discover the tunnels underneath it and do whatever they need to. but it's a very, very tricky military operation to clear a hospital with all its corridors and rooms while there are hundreds of patients inside. >> we know the u.s. believes there is intel that shows hamas is using part of this facility, it's possible israel cannot evacuate, right? we've heard from hospital officials who say they do not trust israeli force twhs it comes to helping them and obviously they're in dire neared of help but don't trust them. when you hear about them talking about being surgical, the idf saying they're not aware of people firing inside the hospital. this is what we heard from one idf spokesperson here on cnn. they say they're shooting men if we see hamas terrorists. what do you make of that? >> well, it's hard to gauge because there's no embedded reporters. israeli forces are trained and by and large they obey the law of war. there's no reason to dispute the spokesman's claims. i would force the civilians inside to evacuate, give them an order to do so as the hospital has become a battleground and it's no place for civilians if that's the case. >> colonel, the idf was looking for hostages. and, in doing this, we're talking about a very dangerous type of warfare. can you describe what they're going through? >> yeah, finding hostages without accurate intelligence is looking for a needle in a haystack. they have to examine every room, every basement, every piece of the facility plus the tunnels underneath. and then the chances are that the hostages will be evacuated before the israeli forces can reach them. so this is a very, very difficult situation in which the idf finds itself, and my guess is that the mission to destroy hamas comes first, because it's an existential crisis for israel. the recovery of the hostages is probably a secondary goal, although still an important one. >> there's two wars here. there is the war that is going on to destroy hamas. there's also a pr war for the hearts and minds and for a generation, certainly, of the republic and around the world and for people who are sympathetic to them and sympathetic to the palestinians, and that has huge ramifications for the future. how do you see this going right now? >> right now it's going against israel, despite the fact that hamas started this conflict with a brutal and horrific terrorist attack on october 7th, the fact that israel has responded and has now killed more than 11,000 palestinians in retaliation, i think the world sees it as overkill. and, unfortunately, although the israelis are doing what they're doing to secure their national security, they're losing in the court of world opinion. and i don't see that changing. there's just simply going to be more noncombatant losses to come as the israeli defense forces grind their way through gaza city. >> yeah, the scenes are horrific. colonel, we appreciate your time and expertise. thank you. >> thank you. and still to come, the fulton county prosecutor's office in georgia is now asking a judge to seal evidence in the case. this is happening as we're learning who admitted to leaking video interviews from the case. we are live from outside the court.

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