And competition from china, among plenty others. There were punches and jabs, counter points and cross talk. But with front runner donald trump sitting out the debate for the second time running, no one on the stage was in a position to deliver a knockout blow. The question will be, which of the candidates put in a Strong Enough performance to win over some voters. Florida Governor Ron Desantis was asked who should be to blame in the event of a Us Government shutdown. He took at aim washington in general, and then the current and former president s in this debate on the fox business network. Please spare me the crocodile business network. Please spare me the Crocodile Tears business network. Please spare me the Crocodile Tears for me the Crocodile Tears for these people. And where isjoe biden . Hes completely missing to action from leadership. And you know who else is missing in action . Donald trump is missing in action. He should be on action . Donald trump is missing in action. He should be on this stage tonight. He owes it to you to defend his record, are they added 7. 8 trillion to the debt. Joining me live is a panel of experts brakkton booker, National Political correspondent at politico. Matt terrill, former chief of staff, marco rubio president ial campaign. Hes now managing partner at firehouse strategies. And Maura Gillespie, former aid to congressman Adam Kinzinger and before that to house speakerjohn boehner. Lets go around the panel and take a quick take from all of you as to what your instant thoughts were about what weve been watching for the last two hours, brakkton, well start with you. Hours, brakkton, well start with vom with you. Well, i think that the candidates with you. Well, i think that the candidates were with you. Well, i think that the candidates were doing | with you. Well, i think that the candidates were doing their best to differentiate themselves from their counterparts. And what i absolutely think is that these candidates were really trying to counterprogramming, trying to counterprogramming, trying to get past what donald trump was doing in michigan, where he was doing in michigan, where he was campaigning for the General Election there. Election there. Matt, whats our election there. Matt, whats your quick election there. Matt, whats your quick view . Election there. Matt, whats your quick view . Certainly, l election there. Matt, whats i your quick view . Certainly, we saw some your quick view . Certainly, we saw some of your quick view . Certainly, we saw some of the your quick view . Certainly, we saw some of the candidates i your quick view . Certainly, we | saw some of the candidates on the stage, trying to Draw A Contrast the stage, trying to Draw A Contrast themselves and President Biden tonight. In some President Biden tonight. In some cases, amongst themselves and President Trump tonight. In this debate, its not likely to change this debate, its not likely to change the course of this race. Certainly, change the course of this race. Certainly, a recognition amongst the candidates and their amongst the candidates and their teams nationwide, particularly on the other side of the particularly on the other side of the aisle, that this doesnt io of the aisle, that this doesnt go around former President Trump go around former President Trump it go around former President Trump. It goes straight through President Trump. It goes straight through President Trump. And the bottom line now President Trump. And the bottom line now is President Trump. And the bottom line now is that former President Trump may have not been President Trump may have not been on President Trump may have not been on the stage. Sucking up a lot of been on the stage. Sucking up a lot of the been on the stage. Sucking up a lot of the oxygen on the stage. Sucking lot of the oxygen on the stage. Sucking up a lot of the oxygen in this sucking up a lot of the oxygen in this race. Right now, hes a clear in this race. Right now, hes a clear frontrunner in the race. If clear frontrunner in the race. If any clear frontrunner in the race. If any of clear frontrunner in the race. If any of the candidates expect to win if any of the candidates expect to win the nomination, every second to win the nomination, every second that is focused on him is really second that is focused on him is really wasted time. Look, the nomination for this party its not the nomination for this party its not going to be up to the incumbent president. This is about incumbent president. This is about former President Trump now about former President Trump now hes about former President Trump now. Hes the frontrunner. The debate now. Hes the frontrunner. The debate would have been the opportunity to do that. Maura, can we get opportunity to do that. Maura, can we get your opportunity to do that. Maura, can we get your quick opportunity to do that. Maura, can we get your quick take opportunity to do that. Maura, can we get your quick take as. Can we get your quick take as well . What was your overarching view with the debate . I well . What was your overarching view with the debate . View with the debate . I think for someone view with the debate . I think for someone who view with the debate . I think for someone who is view with the debate . I think for someone who is looking l view with the debate . I think| for someone who is looking to actually hear from candidates, give concise answers that answers the question and presents the Smaller Government values that republicans are supposed to stand by, they would have really appreciated hearing from the governor boergham. He answered them. I think that theyre going to be disapointed when they hear that tonight, donald trump was talking about how not a single one of the candidates is a viable candidate for him to be a Vice President. Hell be disapointed because clearly he was running for donald trump on that stage and trying to take any and all attention he could. And it clearly got him caught out from any lies he spewed out on stage. Out from any lies he spewed out on state. �. ,. , out from any lies he spewed out onstaue. �. , � , on stage. And what about matts oint on stage. And what about matts point there on stage. And what about matts point there that on stage. And what about matts point there that any on stage. And what about matts point there that any success point there that any success for any of the candidates, the path to that is straight through donald trump . Donald trum is through donald trump . Donald trump is a through donald trump . Donald trump is a part through donald trump . Donald trump is a part of through donald trump . Donald trump is a part of this, through donald trump . Donald trump is a part of this, right. L trump is a part of this, right. Hes ahead in the polls. And he is having counterprogramming but i think with this, especially for democratic voters and republican voter, he he no longer thinks that he should have to earn your vote. That should be owe fencive to us as voters. We want it hear him answerfor the us as voters. We want it hear him answer for the questions and answerfor their him answer for the questions and answer for their past. If donald trump was president for four years and has a lot to answer for. Four years and has a lot to answerfor. And four years and has a lot to answer for. And voters four years and has a lot to answerfor. And voters need those answers and they wont get it if hes going to hide away from the debate stage. Brakkton, this debate was a lot livelier than the one we saw in milwaukee . Livelier than the one we saw in milwaukee . ,. , milwaukee . Yeah, much Fiestier Amon all milwaukee . Yeah, much Fiestier Among all of milwaukee . Yeah, much Fiestier Among all of the milwaukee . Yeah, much Fiestier Among all of the couldnted among all of the couldnted dates among all of the couldnted dates. And mixed up, especially with cyril dates. And mixed up, especially with cyril ramaphosa, who vivek with cyril ramaphosa, who Vivek Ramaswamy surged in polls Vivek Ramaswamy surged in polls. And tim scott came to life in polls. And tim scott came to life in a polls. And tim scott came to life in a way that wasnt there life in a way that wasnt there. You saw towards the end of the there. You saw towards the end of the debate, nikki haley was getting of the debate, nikki haley was getting into it with tim scott over getting into it with tim scott over a getting into it with tim scott over a really odd topic over curtains over a really odd topic over curtains in over a really odd topic over curtains in the residence of the curtains in the residence of the un curtains in the residence of the un ambassador when she was serving the un ambassador when she was serving as the un ambassador when she was serving as un ambassador to the un. Serving as un ambassador to the un and serving as un ambassador to the un. And so, ithink serving as un ambassador to the un. And so, i think what err seeing un. And so, i think what err seeing as un. And so, i think what err seeing as the other panellists allowed seeing as the other panellists allowed to is a lot of the candidates are trying to claw their candidates are trying to claw their way and get within striking distance of trump. The debate striking distance of trump. The debate stage provides the best opportunity to do that. But in reality. Opportunity to do that. But in reality, the gop voters that are going to make the provisions in the primary dehates provisions in the primary debates in the states starting injanuary, they seem to have already injanuary, they seem to have already made up their minds. So it is a already made up their minds. So it is a lot already made up their minds. So it is a lot of already made up their minds. So it is a lot of the candidates who it is a lot of the candidates who were on the stage today trying who were on the stage today trying to who were on the stage today trying to play catch up and really trying to play catch up and really trying to get into second really trying to get into second place, second position, to punch second place, second position, to punch their ticket out of iowa to punch their ticket out of iowa and to punch their ticket out of iowa and into New Hampshire. Matt, iowa and into New Hampshire. Matt, do iowa and into New Hampshire. Matt, do you think on that point, anyone will have changed the dial on the polls for themselves . The dial on the polls for themselves . ~. ,. , themselves . Well, not tonight. Look, i themselves . Well, not tonight. Look. I dont themselves . Well, not tonight. Look, i dont think themselves . Well, not tonight. Look, i dont think that themselves . Well, not tonight. Look, i dont think that this look, i dont think that this debate look, i dont think that this debate is look, i dont think that this debate is going look, i dont think that this debate is going to look, i dont think that this debate is going to make. Look, i dont think that this i debate is going to make much look, i dont think that this debate is going to make much of a difference debate is going to make much of a difference. Inaudible debate is going to make much of a difference. Inaudible and a difference. Inaudible and looking a difference. Inaudible and looking at a difference. Inaudible and looking at whats a difference. Inaudible and looking at whats there a difference. Inaudible and looking at whats there amongst each looking at whats there amongst each other~ looking at whats there amongst each other. Right looking at whats there amongst each other. Right now, looking at whats there amongst each other. Right now, this each other. Right now, this race each other. Right now, this race is each other. Right now, this race is for each other. Right now, this race is for president each other. Right now, this| race is for President Trump. And race is for President Trump. And the race is for President Trump. And the bottom race is for President Trump. And the bottom line race is for President Trump. And the bottom line is race is for President Trump. And the bottom line is thatl race is for President Trump. I and the bottom line is that the former and the bottom line is that the former president and the bottom line is that the former president is and the bottom line is that the former president is the former president is the frontrunner. Former president is the frontrunner. And former president is the frontrunner. And look, | former president is the i frontrunner. And look, right now, frontrunner. And look, right now, inaudible frontrunner. And look, right now, inaudible there frontrunner. And look, right now, inaudible there is. Frontrunner. And look, right now, inaudible there is a | now, inaudible there is a pivotal now, inaudible there is a pivotal time. Now, inaudible there is a pivotal time. The now, inaudible there is a l pivotal time. The candidates dont pivotal time. The candidates dont have pivotal time. The candidates dont have a pivotal time. The candidates dont have a whole pivotal time. The candidates dont have a whole lot pivotal time. The candidates dont have a whole lot of i pivotal time. The candidates. Dont have a whole lot of time. Theyre dont have a whole lot of time. Theyre not dont have a whole lot of time. Theyre notjust dont have a whole lot of time. Theyre not just speaking i dont have a whole lot of time. Theyre not just speaking to i theyre not just speaking to voters theyre not just speaking to voters in theyre not just speaking to voters in this theyre not just speaking to voters in this race, theyre not just speaking to voters in this race, but i theyre not just speaking to voters in this race, but alsoj voters in this race, but also speaking voters in this race, but also speaking to voters in this race, but also speaking to other voters in this race, but also. Speaking to other governors. Voters in this race, but also i speaking to other governors. If theyre speaking to other governors. If theyre not speaking to other governors. If theyre not winning, speaking to other governors. If theyre not winning, theyre i theyre not winning, theyre going theyre not winning, theyre going to theyre not winning, theyre going to run theyre not winning, theyre going to run out theyre not winning, theyre going to run out of theyre not winning, theyre going to run out of money. I going to run out of money. Theyre going to run out of money. Theyre trying going to run out of money. Theyre trying to going to run out of money. Theyre trying to stay i going to run out of money. I theyre trying to stay there. We saw theyre trying to stay there. We saw one theyre trying to stay there. We saw one missing theyre trying to stay there. I we saw one missing candidate on the debate we saw one missing candidate on the debate station. We saw one missing candidate on the debate station. Part we saw one missing candidate on the debate station. Part of the debate station. Part of this the debate station. Part of thisiust the debate station. Part of thisjust stayed the debate station. Part of this just stayed on the debate station. Part of this just stayed on the i the debate station. Part of. Thisjust stayed on the debate race thisjust stayed on the debate race and thisjust stayed on the debate race and becomes thisjust stayed on the debate race and becomes a thisjust stayed on the debate race and becomes a donor race and becomes a Donor Outreach race and becomes a Donor Outreach and race and becomes a Donor Outreach and it race and becomes a Donor Outreach and it is race and becomes a donor. Outreach and it is important that outreach and it is important that the outreach and it is important that the Candidates Outreach and it is important that the candidates show. Outreach and it is important. That the candidates show that theyre that the candidates show that theyre breaking that the candidates show that theyre breaking through, i that the candidates show that theyre breaking through, notj theyre breaking through, not ust theyre breaking through, not just to theyre breaking through, not just to get theyre breaking through, not just to get more theyre breaking through, not just to get more voters theyre breaking through, not just to get more voters but i theyre breaking through, notj just to get more voters but to demonstrate just to get more voters but to demonstrate to just to get more voters but to demonstrate to donors just to get more voters but to demonstrate to donors that l just to get more voters but to i demonstrate to donors that they et demonstrate to donors that they get in demonstrate to donors that they get in the demonstrate to donors that they get in the race demonstrate to donors that they get in the race. Get in the race. Well, youve all mentioned get in the race. Well, youve all mentioned the all mentioned the counterprogramming that was going on tonight. Of course, the former president , donald trump, in detroit, in michigan, getting a tour of an Auto Worker Plant and meeting some auto workers as well. And we can have a bit of a listen as to what hes been saying tonight. I want a future that protects american labour, not foreign labour. A future that puts American Dream overforeign profits and a future that raises american wages, that strengthens american industry, that builds National Pride and defend this countrys dignity, not squanders it all to build up Foreign Countries that hate us. Maura, what did you make of donald trump and what he said tonight, and just holding that rally in the first place . Its rally in the first place . Its slirhtl rally in the first place . Its slightly embarrassing that he is making a mockery of our system is making a mockery of our system of having debates and for running for president and taking for running for president and taking it for running for president and taking it seriously. He is not. He has taking it seriously. He is not. He has already achieved that he thinks he has already achieved that he thinks and he already thinks hes thinks and he already thinks hes president again. So thats one take hes president again. So thats one take away that i have. But also. One take away that i have. But also, rallying about workers and also, rallying about workers and being there for the uaw, the union and being there for the uaw, the Union Workers and again, he made the Union Workers and again, he made promises there that he will never follow through on. Hes will never follow through on. Hes also will never follow through on. Hes also said that hes advocating for the workers when he has advocating for the workers when he has countless law suits against he has countless law suits against him and his company for not paying against him and his company for not paying workers on time or at all not paying workers on time or at all and not paying workers on time or at all and it being not paying workers on time or at alland it being in violation of contracts. Sol Think Violation of contracts. Sol think that the apposition of what think that the apposition of what hes juxtaposition of what what hes juxtaposition of what hes what hes juxtaposition of what hes doing is really frustrating as someone who heiieves frustrating as someone who believes in the Republican Party. Believes in the Republican Party, of what it has been and what party, of what it has been and what it party, of what it has been and what it continues and can be and what it continues and can be and to what it continues and can be and to see it being there with vivek and to see it being there with Vivek Ramaswamy is very fraying Vivek Ramaswamy is very fra inc. , Vivek Ramaswamy is very fra inc. ,. , fraying. Matt, do you share those frustrations . Fraying. Matt, do you share those frustrations . Look, l fraying. Matt, do you share those frustrations . Look, i| those frustrations . Look, i think many those frustrations . Look, i think many voters those frustrations . Look, i think many voters right i those frustrations . Look, i| think many voters right now look at this race to make their decisions on where they stand. You have many voters in the race right now who are backing former President Trump. There are some voters who are undecided and some voters who are backing the other candidates who reason debate stage. I think right now, the reality is former President Trump has a very large following in the ggop particularly in gop particularly in gop particularly in gop particularly in New Hampshire and south carolina. Theyll ultimately decide the election. But the reality is, former President Trump, i think many would argue right now, is acting like hes the General Election candidate. Whether people like that or not or agree with it or not, thats how hes acting. And the reality is that the other candidates are fighting for the nomination. The reality is that former President Trump was in michigan tonight. Thats not going to be likely a critical state in winning the nomination nor president. There will be a crucial state in winning the election. Right now, the optics, i suspect hes already the nominee. Whether people like it or not, thats the optics being driven in the race right nowment and for candidates to change that, they have to Draw A Contrast. We saw some of that taking place tonight. But for any of the candidates to breakthrough, they have to focus their time and energy on form President Trump and demonstrating to the voter that is they can earn support. The challenge is that former President Trump has a lot of the gop candidates there. And even for the undecided there, many of them still like former President Trump, so its a challenge for the candidates and a Balancing Act and something that none of the candidates appear it have quite harnessed yet. Live now to dan merica. Hes National Political reporter at the news website the messenger. Oh, im sorry, maura, Ispoke Overyou oh, im sorry, maura, ispoke over you there. Oh, im sorry, maura, i spoke over you there. Oh, im sorry, maura, i spoke over you there. The republicans are looking over you there. The republicans are looking to over you there. The republicans are looking to target over you there. The republicans are looking to target some i are looking to target some seats are looking to target some seats. So michigan is going to be important for republicans and looking to target New Hampshire polling has said that more hampshire polling has said that more than half of the primary voters more than half of the primary voters in more than half of the primary voters in the gop wants somebody other than donald trump somebody other than donald trump. So i think that this wiii trump. So i think that this will some opportunities. But as we both will some opportunities. But as we both said, trump is certainly acting like he is already certainly acting like he is already the candidate and that is what already the candidate and that is what we need to compete with as far is what we need to compete with as far as is what we need to compete with as far as getting somebody else to step as far as getting somebody else to step ahead here in the gop primary to step ahead here in the gop rima. �. To step ahead here in the gop rima. � ,. ,. , to step ahead here in the gop rima. � ,. ,. ,. , primary. Ok, lets go over to dan mercia primary. Ok, lets go over to dan mercia in primary. Ok, lets go over to dan mercia in michigan i primary. Ok, lets go over to dan mercia in michigan and l primary. Ok, lets go over to | dan mercia in michigan and he has been tracking the movements of donald trump there for the night. And did he, as the panel have been discussing there, seem like he was already on a General Election trail . Absolutely. I mean, there were two things that really came out of this event today. The first is what youve been speaking about for the last few minutes is donald trump is acting like he is the front runner in this race because he is the frontrunner in this race. You know, he barely mentioned the Republican Debate that was happening at the same time that he was speaking in michigan. He focused almost all of his attacks on donald trump. I think he mentioned ron desantis one time, possibly. And then he reallyjust one time, possibly. And then he really just stiff armed the indictments that he is under. The four different indictments as if they were just a nominal issue hes facing not significant indict from the Department Ofjustice and other legal bodies. And the second thing you notice is donald trump knows that michigan is going to be critical. If he is the nominee for 202a. Its why he was here today. If he has any chance of beating joe biden next year, he needs to rekindle the magic that he captured with Union Voterses in 2016 when he was facing Hillary Clinton. According to exit polls, Hillary Clinton here in michigan only got 53 of Union Household support. That is very low for a democratic nominee. Joe biden in 2020 got about 62 , according to the same exit polls. And thats why the Union Supporters are so important. Obviously, donald trump won michigan in 2016. He lost it by a much larger margin in 2020. But this was a complicated visit for trump. He is here speaking, yes, at the time of a uaw strike. But he didnt go to a picket line and he spoke at a venue that was a nonunion site. So while there were uaw workers in the audience, especially uaw workers who support the president , it wasnt like this was a Uaw Organised event. And in fact, former President Trump asked for the endorsement from the uaw. The uaw hasnt endorsed trump on their own. They are part of a federation of unions that did endorse the president earlier in the yearment and that said a lot that donald trump, this man who doesnt really go out of his way to say nice things about people who have said bad things about him, was multiple times asking the uaw for their endorsement, and at one point, asking sean fein, the head of the uaw, to endorse him, and he said some pretty brutal things about the former president as he comes here to michigan. So it was a really unique event. The showed a lot of what trump has to do if hes going to win the presidency in 202a. More than anything, your other panellists have said, it showed that donald trump really doesnt see the republican primary as anything more than a nominal small challenge at this point. 0k, thank you for that, with me is mike madrid. We have been discussing about the counter programming, donald trump and mitch again. Lets go back to the events of the last two hours. How do you think it went. ,. Two hours. How do you think it went. ,. ,. , went. Pretty vibrant debate, a lot of discussion, went. Pretty vibrant debate, a lot of discussion, the lot of discussion, the performative elements that have animated the Republican Party in the last few years, but substantive differences between the candidates especially in Foreign Policy why disagreements on ukraine and our involvement as a country internationally soppy orbit of everything for everybody. Irate everything for everybody. We are outside everything for everybody. We are outside the Ronald Reagan library, his spirit was evoked plenty of times in the debate and especially that section around ukraine and russia. This is sacred ground around ukraine and russia. This is sacred ground for is sacred ground for republicans, its important to have the presence of a Ronald Reagan guiding what has traditionally defined conservative logics for this country until the rise of donald trump, it is very peculiar to see the president like donald trump the last republican president , being wishy washy on the Russia Ukraine issue, not supporting nato the way we historically have, not having that strident strong Foreign Policy, that Ronald Reagan exemplified. And to watch that debate on stage especially here at the library was a little bit concerning. Republican party has lost a lot of what it has meant to have some american style leadership with our allies in the world and i think that is on the mind of a lot of people in this room, that is still one of the defining issues for republicanism, having the ability to work with our allies to advance the values that we believe in, and i think seeing that hesitancy not only with donald trump but with Governor Ron Desantis and even Vivek Ramaswamy, with kind of a ready Mealymouthed Position on russia and our support for ukraine, had that audience divided. There is concern there about our resolve with standing with ukraine. ~. ,. , ukraine. With Foreign Policy ukraine. With Foreign Policy ukraine and ukraine. With Foreign Policy ukraine and immigration i ukraine. With Foreign Policy| ukraine and immigration are ukraine. With Foreign Policy i ukraine and immigration are the policies of president has control over, a lot of talk over localised issues that would be in the remit of governors, five of the seven having been governors in the past off an excellent point and. ,. ,. , and. The party has devolved into this populist and. The party has devolved | into this Populist Nationalism by donald trump, and cultural issues, some of these were not within the work of the president or the federal government, with the federal system they are reserved for the states and so many states are leading On The Issues, the red states, some getting pushback from blue states, democratic states, that is where a lot of the average republican voter feels that tension, as the Republican Party has begun to lean into these cultural issues at has lived a lot of voters disillusioned about where we stand on broader thematic s about what has defied republicanism in the post cold war era. Republicanism in the postcold war era. , war era. You say there is concern war era. You say there is concern in war era. You say there is concern in the war era. You say there is concern in the room i war era. You say there is concern in the room and | war era. You say there is i concern in the room and people are divided how reflective is that of the Republican Party, writ large . Writ large . This is the party of donald writ large . This is the party of donald trump, writ large . This is the party of donald trump, he i writ large . This is the party of donald trump, he was i writ large . This is the party. Of donald trump, he was not writ large . This is the party i of donald trump, he was not in the room but his presence was here and this is still very much a donald trump crowd, but it is a subset of republicanism, this is what we call the country club crowd, not church goers but people that other major donors and heavy hitters in the party that get invited to these vip events, not representative of a party becoming non college educated, increasingly blue collar and focused on blue collar and focused on blue collar White Working Class issues. There is a discrepancy on cultural issues, one of the most awkward moments in the room was the discussion about abortion issues, the pro life issue which is with the republican bases at, but this room is not comfortable with that discussion and the pro life stance, if you took a private polity with the overwhelming support for a pro choice position and that is when he saw Chris Christie the former governor of newjersey take the position he did. I5 take the position he did. Is the Republican Party facing an expositional point at this point in the campaign . Point in the campaign . Existential. Point in the campaign . Existential. I point in the campaign . Existential. I think it is and i think donald trump will win the nomination, there are so many candidates starting to finally after eight years articulate a very different Policy Direction including his Vice President , mike pence, you are starting to say maybe the wiebes is breaking a law but, maybe whatever this hysteria we have been involved with may not have been involved with may not have had a stronger basis as we ought, there is some weakening. Im not suggesting we are talking half the Republican Party, i am talking ten or 20 of the party, in a country where republicans have lost the popular vote, seven out of eight of the last president ial elections the Republican Party cant afford to lose votes of its going to be viable in these questions are starting to populate the minds of these voters and give as to whether this is right direction we are heading in or not. This is right direction we are heading in or not. Was there an one heading in or not. Was there anyone on heading in or not. Was there anyone on that heading in or not. Was there anyone on that stage heading in or not. Was there anyone on that stage you i heading in or not. Was there i anyone on that stage you could be that new leader. I was shocked nikki haley did as well as she did, a lot of Heads Turning and nodding, a lot more applause for her going into the later part of this event. She articulated later part of this event. She articulated a later part of this event. She articulated a strong later part of this event. She articulated a strong policy about american policy in the world time when the Chattering Class and Vivek Ramaswamy saying maybe russia is not a bad guy, the difference could not be clear and the room broke strongly for nikki haley, thats good for the Republican Party and the country. Lats thats good for the Republican Party and the country. Party and the country. Lots to digester party and the country. Lots to digester. Thank party and the country. Lots to digester. Thank you party and the country. Lots to digester. Thank you for i party and the country. Lots to digester. Thank you for being | digester. Thank you for being here on bbc news tonight. We still have our panel with us, brakkton booker, from politico, mike terrill previous hit of staff at the marco rubio campaign. An Maura Gillespie former aide to Congressman Adam consider. Lots of interesting points from mike madrid as to where the Republican Party stands, we saw a lot of that pulled apart on the debate stage tonight . Brute pulled apart on the debate stage tonight . Pulled apart on the debate stage tonight . We did, i think this existential stage tonight . We did, i think this existential crisis stage tonight . We did, i think this existential crisis mike i this existential crisis mike was talking about is something that the Republican Party has been grappling with for a long time, i think that certainly since donald trump has been on stage, on the national stage, republicans really have a quest to win back the white house, and a lot of the calculation from much of the gop electorate is, look, why dont we just go back to donald trump, we know he has one an election before in 2016. He probably has the easiest path and withjoe bidens numbers, poll numbers sagging you might have a really good shot at toppling joe biden, since a lot of americans are still unhappy with the direction of where the United States is going. I think thats probably why you see a lot of folks siding with donald trump. Obviously this is not clear on the debate stage, the debaters and other candidates trying to do is coax donald trump to come back to the stage, have this debate but they have not seemed to be anything from donald trump, it seems to be from the political class, they want a debate and they want to see how donald trump is underfire, under duress because i think with the Republican Party s Worst Nightmare is donald trump goes to the primary process unscathed, it gets onstage with President Biden and collapses under the weight of not having gone through this rigourous campaign cycle. It remains to be seen what happens in the next debate but i think that is what is concerning for a lot of republicans, p is not Battle Tested how can he stand up against a sitting president. Its interesting what you say there, we saw Chris Christie almost goading almost looking down the barrel of the lens and saying donald trump, youre afraid, thats why youre not here. , , here. Donald duck. This might be remembered here. Donald duck. This might be remembered tongue i here. Donald duck. This might be remembered tongue and i here. Donald duck. This might i be remembered tongue and cheek about this being the donald duck debate because of how much Barbs Christie was throwing. I think that he fell flat, but the Campaign Team had a meme ready to go and fired that off on social media. Christie and others are tries to get donald trump to get under his skin and get him back to the debate stage and well see if that works. ~ stage and well see if that works. , ~ ,. ,. ,. , works. Ok, thank you for that, itrakkton works. Ok, thank you for that, brakkton. We works. Ok, thank you for that, brakkton. We are works. Ok, thank you for that, brakkton. We are going works. Ok, thank you for that, brakkton. We are going to i works. Ok, thank you for that, brakkton. We are going to say| brakkton. We are going to say goodbye to our viewers who have joined us on pbs. Thank you very much for staying with us. Well have lots more on this on bbc news, and we will stay now with our panel here carrying on the discussion live from the Ronald Reagan president ial landy here in simi valley here in california. 0k, in california. Ok, so were stilljoined by our guests. Maura, on that point, the points that mike madrid was making about where the Republican Party is at, at the Republican Party is at, at the moment, and that focus on Foreign Policy as we are here at the Ronald Reagan president ial library and that was something that he cared so strongly about. Who impressed you in terms of what they were saying about Foreign Policy, particularly ukraine, obviously being one of the big issues at the moment . Being one of the big issues at the moment . Governor christie and senator the moment . Governor christie and senator scott the moment . Governor christie and senator scott were the moment . Governor christie and senator scott were really i and senator scott were really pretty forceful. In trying to ill say in pretty reasonable words about what it is that we do when we support ukraine and why it is that we do it and what it does for American Families at home much not only for this, families at home much not only forthis, but families at home much not only for this, but supporting our allies around the world is a benefit for all of us. So they laid that out quickly. And saying what is really important, given the fact as mike had mentioned, you have donald trump and Governor Desantis looking at that and their words about ukraine funding and how were just throwing money and how it is wasteful and what not. Thats not the case and couldnt be further from the truth. And if we dont support our allies, how will we ever expect them to stand with us when we need them. So i thought that they made those cases clearly to the American People and especially to donors but also to primary voters especially. Because they are being swayed by people like donald trump to vote otherwise. Matt, what was your view on that . , matt, what was your view on that . ,. , matt, what was your view on that . ,. ,. , that . Certainly, differences on oinion that . Certainly, differences on opinion in that . Certainly, differences on opinion in foreign that . Certainly, differences on opinion in Foreign Policy, i opinion in Foreign Policy, whether it is ukraine and russia whether it is ukraine and russia. So we saw the candidates wane on that and as a big candidates wane on that and as a big part candidates wane on that and as a big part of the debate, certainly. There were other components based on Foreign Policy. Components based on Foreign Policy, such as discussions on china policy, such as discussions on china its policy, such as discussions on china. Its not likely that the discussions were on china, ukraine discussions were on china, ukraine or russia, will be taking ukraine or russia, will be taking place throughout the primary taking place throughout the primary debate and the primary process primary debate and the primary process. These are key themes that will process. These are key themes that will be rising with General Election voters. They will be General Election voters. They will be top of mind likely with the General Election voters in the General Election voters in the next the General Election voters in the next year. But in the end, when the next year. But in the end, when it the next year. But in the end, when it comes to Foreign Policy or domestic policy, typically what or domestic policy, typically what happens in either the Republican Party or the Democratic Party is the nominee or the Democratic Party is the nominee or the incumbent president to be there or the incumbent president to be there. So right now, the reat be there. So right now, the Real Question is where does former Real Question is where does former President Trump stand On The Issues former President Trump stand On The Issues. He again, as the clear the issues. He again, as the clear frontrunner in the debates. So all of the issues are being debates. So all of the issues are being discussed whether it is on are being discussed whether it is on Foreign Policy or domestic policy. Ultimately, the spotlight will be on former President Trump on where he stands President Trump on where he stands and likely going into years stands and likely going into years convention at the rnc and beyond at the General Election, youll see the party by and election, youll see the party by and large coalescing around that by and large coalescing around that that by and large coalescing around that. That will be the big question. Where is he standing on the question. Where is he standing on the policies . Where he is driving on the policies . Where he is driving them . Ultimately assuming that he remains the front assuming that he remains the front runner in this race, that will front runner in this race, that will be front runner in this race, that will be the front runner in this race, that will be the ultimate question. That will be the ultimate question. That was will be the ultimate question. That was one of the conditions for taking part tonight, of course, for the candidates that they did have to that they that they did have to that they that they would rally around. Lets have a listen to another exchange from the debate. This one is Vivek Ramaswamy and nikki haley. One is Vivek Ramaswamy and nikki haley one is Vivek Ramaswamy and nikki haley. Just because putin is an evil dictator nikki haley. Just because putin is an evil dictator does nikki haley. Just because putin is an evil dictator does not i is an evil dictator does not mean that that is good. This is a country that has banned opposition parties. All speak atonce excuse me. Tbs, all speak atonce excuse me. All speak atonce excuse me. �. ,. , excuse me. A win for russia is a win for excuse me. A win for russia is a win for china. Excuse me. A win for russia is a win for china. You excuse me. A win for russia is a win for china. You like i a win for china. You like china a win for china. You like china. Thats why you are ok. Youll china. Thats why you are ok. Youll have china. Thats why you are ok. Youll have your chance in a moment. The hurling personal insults isnt helping. China is the real he my and were driving russia further into chinas arms. Chinas arms. Thats one example chinas arms. Thats one example of chinas arms. Thats one example of how chinas arms. Thats one example of how things l chinas arms. Thats one i example of how things got heated, as you were saying. Yes, but i think that he was fed up with the how many lies were spewed if the last debate to this debate. I think she was just fed up with it and wanted to call him out. They mentioned several things about china, about russia, iran. Both she and pence did tie the two together when it comes to ukraine and what putins role is. But i think what she was back and forth with Vivek Ramaswamy, she called him out for his own Business Dealings with china. The flip flop on social media and then joining tiktok. We discussed at length that the role that that has there in controlling our information. So i thought that she came back with fire but also facts. Truth of what they were saying versus what they were saying versus what they were saying versus what they were saying on the stage. I thought that it was powerful for them to see. And it all sounds great when theyre saying these things