Transcripts For BBCNEWS Saturday In Parliament 20240713

Now on bbc news, saturday in parliament. Hello there, and welcome to this special edition of saturday in parliament, as the commons and the lords sit at a weekend for the first time in 37 years to discuss borisjohnsons brexit deal. But the Prime Minister is defeated again, as mps back delay. The ayes to the right, 322. Murmurs the noes to the left, 306. Cheering Boris Johnson remains defiant. I will not negotiate a delay with the eu. The commons spent five hours debating the latest brexit deal, with theresa may making her first Public Comments since standing down. If you want to deliver brexit, if you want to keep faith with the british people, if you want this country to move forward, then vote for the deal today. Opposition mps say whats been agreed this time is even worse than the deal she negotiated. Voting for a deal today wont end brexit. He knows that, if given the option, that people will reject his bad deal and choose to remain in the European Union. And peers, too, remained divided on the way forward. An extension would, by definition, increase the uncertainty. A second referendum would increase the uncertainty. A general election to determine this issue would increase the uncertainty. This was supposed to be the easy bit well, i look forward to the difficult bit. Or maybe not. It had been billed super saturday, the first commons weekend sitting since the outbreak of the falklands war in 1982. In front of mps, borisjohnsons re negotiated Withdrawal Agreement, the divorce arrangement for the uks exit from the eu. The plan had been for mps to vote on whether or not to give it the go ahead. But former conservative sir Oliver Letwin changed all that. Hed put down an amendment to withhold approval for the deal until the legislation to enact it was safely passed, automatically forcing the Prime Minister to request a further postponement of brexit until the 31st of january. Pundits predicted there could be just a smattering of votes in it and so it proved when the letwin amendment was put to mps. The ayes to the right, 322. The noes to the left, 306. So the ayes have it, the ayes have it. Unlock a defeat for the government by 16. The result meant that, under the law known as the benn act, the Prime Minister would have to write to the eu asking for brexit to be delayed. But he struck a defiant note in the commons. I continue in the very strong belief that the best thing for the uk and for the whole of europe is for us to leave with this new deal on october the 31st. And, to anticipate the questions that are coming from the benches opposite, i will not negotiate a delay with the eu. And neither does the law compel me to do so. I will tell our friends and colleagues in the eu exactly what ive told everyone in the last 88 days that ive served as Prime Minister. That further delay would be bad for this country, bad for our European Union, and bad for democracy the Prime Minister must now comply with the law. He can no longer use the threat of a no deal crash out to blackmail members to support his sell out deal. Jeremy corbyn. Well, that turned out to be the only vote of the day, with the leader of the commons indicating he now planned to hold a meaningful vote on monday instead. So, how did we get here . As campaigners for a second referendum began marching outside to urge a fresh vote, borisjohnson set out to explain and hopefully sell his deal to mps. Much of it is the same as that agreed by his predecessor, theresa may, but there are key differences. Firstly on customs, or tariff arrangements. The whole of the uk will leave the eu Customs Union, allowing it to strike trade deals with other countries. Tax wont automatically be paid on goods coming into Northern Ireland from Great Britain, but if something is likely to be transported on to the republic, duty will be paid. Eu rules for vat, another tax, will apply in Northern Ireland for goods, not services. And because of these changes, the Northern Ireland assembly will vote on the provisions every four years with a simple majority determining if theyre accepted or not. Well, the Prime Minister knew he had a toughjob on his hands to win over enough mps to get his deal through, and adopted a conciliatory tone, thanking everyone for giving up their saturday. The house will need no reminding that this is the second deal and the fourth vote, 3. 5 years after the nation voted for brexit. And during those years, friendships have been strained, families divided and the attention of this house consumed by a single issue that has, at times, felt incapable of resolution. He said over the last 30 years, some in the eu had described the uk as a half hearted member, but. If we have been half hearted europeans, then it follows logically that with part of our hearts, with half our hearts, we feel something else. A sense of love and respect for european culture and civilisation, of which we are a part. He said the agreement provided for a real brexit, taking back control of money, laws, fisheries and trade, and removed the Northern Ireland backstop. He moved on to the customs arrangements for Northern Ireland. Our agreement ensures, and i quote, unfettered access, market access, for goods moving from Northern Ireland to the rest of the United Kingdoms internal market. It ensures that there should be no tariff on goods circulating within the uk customs territory that is between Great Britain and Northern Ireland unless they are at risk of entering the eu. It ensures an open border, an open border on the island of ireland, a Common Objective of everyone in this house. And it ensures for those living and working alongside the border, there will be no visible or practical changes to their lives. They can carry on as before. I believe that this is a good arrangement, reconciling the special circumstances in Northern Ireland with the minimum possible bureaucratic consequences at a few points of arrival in Northern Ireland, and it is precisely to ensure that those arrangements are acceptable to the people of Northern Ireland that we have made consent a fundamental element of this new deal. And he looked to the uks future relationship with the eu, pledging to involve mps, and he said when it came to regulation, no one believed in lowering standards. And ourfirst decision, on which i believe there will be unanimity, is that in any future trade negotiations, with any country, our National Health service will not be on the table. Cheering he said he thought the best deal had been achieved, and there was a burning desire to get brexit done. Further delay is pointless, expensive and deeply corrosive of public trust. And people simply will not understand how politicians can say with one breath that they want delay to avoid no deal, and then with the next breath that they still want delay when a great deal is there to be done. Now is the time, now is the time, mr speaker, to get this thing done. And i say to all members, let us come together to end. Let us come together as democrats to end this debilitating feud. Let us come together as democrats to get behind this deal, the one proposition that fulfils the verdict of the majority, but which also allows us to bring together the two halves of our hearts, to bring together the two halves of our nation. Lets speak now, both for the 52 and for the 48. Lets go for a deal that can heal this country. Borisjohnson. The labour leader, jeremy corbyn, saw nothing positive in what had been agreed. He has renegotiated the Withdrawal Agreement and made it even worse. Hes renegotiated the political declaration and made that even worse. This government has sought to avoid scrutiny throughout the process, and yesterday evening made empty promises on workers rights and the environment. The same government that spent the last few weeks negotiating in secret to remove from the Withdrawal Agreement legally binding commitments on workers rights and the environment. This government cannot be trusted and these benches will not be duped. This deal, mr speaker, would inevitably and absolutely inevitably lead to a trump trade deal. Forcing the uk. Forcing the uk to diverge from the highest standards and expose our families once again to chlorine washed chicken and hormone treated beef. He said the Prime Minister couldnt be trusted. There was no guarantee the uk would keep pace on Environmental Standards and borisjohnson had promised there would be no border in the irish sea. Voting for a deal today wont end brexit. It wont deliver certainty. And the people should have the final say. The longest serving mp said hed back the deal on one condition. I will vote for his deal once we have given legislative effect to it. When he goes on to negotiate the eventual long term arrangements, he will seek a solution where we have the same completely open access across the channel, across the irish border, to trade and investment in both directions with the European Union that we have now. Boris johnson didnt answer that directly but said he wanted a partnership with maximum trade. The snps westminster leader said there was not one reference to scotland in the agreement. The Prime Minister has returned from brussels to present a deal that he knows that we all know is actually worse than theresa mays deal. A deal that would see scotland shafted by this United Kingdom government left at an economic disadvantage, with scotlands views and interests totally disregarded by this Prime Minister and his government. The Prime Ministers deal removes protections on workers rights. It puts a border down the irish sea and, according to the governments own analysis, will damage our economy on a scale greater than the financial crash. Today, hundreds of thousands of people will be outside, demanding a final say in a peoples vote. Isnt the truth that the reason a Prime Minister refuses their calls is because he knows that if given the option, the people will reject his bad deal and choose to remain in the European Union . This deal puts Northern Ireland, yes, in the uk Customs Union but applies de facto or the European Union customs code. Yes, it does. Read the detail. It also puts us in the vat regime, and in the Single Market regime for a large part of goods and agri food, without any consent upfront, contrary to the agreement made in december 2017 which said only regulatory difference could happen with the consent of the executive and the assembly. It drives a coach and horses through the belfast agreement by altering the Cross Community consent mechanism. It was once said that no british Prime Minister could ever agree to such terms. Thats what you said, sir indeed, those who sought the leadership of the Tory Party Said that at our conference. Will he now abide by that . And please, reconsider the fact that we must leave as one nation together. The Prime Minister asks us with passionate words to vote for his deal with our hearts. But my head cant get round the fact that we are being asked to accept his words in trusting ignorance. He has refused to share the impact assessments. And he only revealed this 535 page legal text today for us today. How could plaid cymru ever support his billionaires brexit . I would gently remind her of what she and i both know, and im a fan of her normally but what she and i both know is that wales voted to leave and i think she should respect that. Isnt the truth that this deal takes a wrecking ball to our social and Environmental Standards . And the reason he wont put it back to the british people is because he knows full well that they see through his bluster and they can see that this is a profoundly bad deal . Caroline lucas. The statement from the Prime Minister went on for two hours and then it was on to the debate on the agreement itself. Borisjohnsons predecessor, theresa may used it to make her first Public Comments on the deal. I hope the whole house will forgive me if i say that standing here i have a distinct sense of deja vu i know how you feel but todays vote is an important. Rebel, shouted a conservative mp. I intend to rebel against all of those who dont want to vote to deliver brexit. Cheering. When this house voted overwhelmingly to give the choice of our membership of the eu to the british people, did we really mean it . When we voted to trigger article 50, did we really mean it . When the two main parties represented in this house stood on manifestos in the 2017 general election to deliver brexit, did we really mean it . I think there can only be one answer to that and that is yes, we did mean it. Yes, we keep faith with the british people and yes, we want to deliver brexit because if this parliament did not mean it, then it is guilty of the most egregious con trick on the british people. If you dont want no deal, you have to vote for a deal. Businesses are crying out for certainty. People want certainty in their lives. Our investors want to be able to invest and want the uncertainty to be got rid of. They want to know this country is moving forward. If you want to deliver on brexit and keep faith with the british people and if you want this country to move forward, then vote for the deal today. Cheering. Theresa may there. Much of the debate centred on sir Oliver Letwins amendment, withholding approval until the legislation implementing the agreement was passed. In effect, forcing a delay beyond october the 31st. The brexit secretary saw no merit in it. His amendment would render todays vote meaningless. It would cause further delay when our constituents and businesses want an end to uncertainty. And are calling for us to get this done. Mr speaker, the public will be appalled by pointless further delay. We need to get brexit done by the 31st of october so the country can move forward and i ask my right honourable friend in that spirit to withdraw his amendment. But his honourable friend declined. I am moving this amendment to ensure that whichever way any future votes may go today or next week or the week after that we can be secure in the knowledge that the uk will have requested an extension tonight which, if granted, can be used if and to the extent necessary and only the extent necessary to prevent a no deal exit. There were strong opinions on both sides of the argument. In voting for the amendment by the right honourable member of dorset west, we will be forced, even if a deal is approved to seek an extension to the 31st of january, underlying that the benn act had only one motivation, to delay brexit and stop it. If that passes, my guess is, and there is an extension, that legislation will go on and on and on and we will never leave. And the right honourable lady is absolutely right. If you want it done, vote against the letwin amendment, and get legislation through by the end of october and get brexit done. The difficulty is that the impression the government is giving is that by insisting that the benn act be effectively subverted and removed that it has other intentions of taking us out at such a gallop that this proper scrutiny cannot take place. And i wish the government would just listen a little bit because i think it would find there is much more Common Ground on this than it has ever been prepared to acknowledge, instead of which it continues to give the impression that itjust wants to drive a coach and horses through the rights of this house to give proper scrutiny. It doesnt cause delay, that exercise has to be gone through anyway. So it is not to vote to delay, it is a vote to get on with looking at the next stage. A stage which is going to have to look up. What it does provide is an insurance policy against signing up to a deal that is not what it seems with the risk of a no deal brexit to boot. If we accept the amendment, we will not have a meaningful vote today. We will not unlock the door to the deal being passed. We will have voted, im afraid, in the terms of that motion for more delay and im afraid on that basis that i would urge everyone who wants us, no, who wants us to honour the referendum mandate to recognise that amendment, however sincerely it has been put, is unnecessary and the question all of us must answer when we return to our constituencies is, did you vote to break the deadlock . Did you vote to end the division of these days . Did you vote to bring the country together . I know members across this house would support the government this afternoon to do just that. Cheering. Michael gove speaking just ahead of that vote on the letwin amendment. Peers returned to westminster today, the conservative former leader Michael Howard urged mps to back Boris Johnson and warned of the Economic Impact of further uncertainty. An extension would, by definition, increase uncertainty. A second referendum would increase uncertainty. A general election to determine this issue would increase the uncertainty. Yet these are the outcomes are urged upon us by those who complain that this deal would cause economic damage. So i beseech them to consider and reflect if they are democrats, they must respect the result of the referendum. If they are realistic, they must recognise the damage to our economy that the prolonged uncertainty which rejection of this deal would bring about. If they have the interests of our country at heart, and i know they do, they must see that this deal presents a unique opportunity to resolve this most intractable issue and to move on and bring our country together again. I commend the Prime Ministers deal to your lordship, serve. Labour called for a second referendum. If this is the best brexit, that a brexit believing Prime Minister considers can be delivered, then why not seek that public mandate for it . My lords, anything less would be a dereliction of duty. For the conservative and unionist party, to be hailing this deal is good for all parts of the United Kingdom, when it leads to disintegration, is frankly shameful. But typical of the lengths that the current Prime Minister will go to try and preserve the unity of the english conservative party. My lords, everyday that goes by, every additional day adds to public uncertainty, aggravates public anger and makes the task of restoring that confidence, that very precious confidence, that much more difficult. It is already going to take years. On thursday evening, catching my train at euston, i overheard one young woman discussing with her companion brexit, and i heard her say, thank god, its over. Well, my lord, it isnt yet. But it really should be. Get brexit done is meaningless. Because we know that whatever happens today, brexit will not be done. We will be on the starting blocks with brexit. This was supposed to be the easy bit well, i look forward to the difficult bit, or maybe not we have seen a remarkable transformation in the Prime Minister from being a bit of a buffoon to being a bit of a statesman. Oh, yes. There is no doubt about that. Hes actually brought. This is what troubles the house. This is a deal he might actually pass and we might actually leave europe. This is an important and exciting day for us. This deal is so good because there is no backstop, no border and the border in the irish sea, there is no border on land, the border on the sea is largely a filter because most of the trade between britain and Northern Ireland in the future would be frictionless as it is today. The other great advantage of the deal to Northern Ireland, it gives a unique position with the foot in both camps. One in europe and one also in our own country. I accept the judgment of two Prime Ministers who did more than anyone else to end an 800 year conflict in the island of ireland. Blair and major, who have warned against instability and i have to say, and i accept theirjudgment far more than the present Prime Minister, who famously said, as regards to the border in ireland, that the consequences were no greater than moving from camden to islington. What ignorance of the history and culture and the sentiment of the people of that province coming from a british Prime Minister. John reid. And that debate in the house of lords ended without a vote. All eyes will now turn to the commons on monday where the government is hoping to put its case again. Mandy baker will be with you then, you can catch her on Bbc Parliament on monday night at 11pm, or search for monday in parliament on bbc iplayer. But from me, alicia mccarthy, and on our saturday in parliament special, goodbye. Some of us are going to see sunshine and generally is a dry day across the country, low pressure drift out into the north sea and allows things to quieten down but its another low flow and so it means a cooler field to the day. And at that low pressure out in the north sea we could just see a out in the north sea we could just seeafairamount out in the north sea we could just see a fair amount of crab drifting in along the east coast with one or two scattered showers pushed down by that not liveries. So head further west and south for the best of the dry sunny moments, highs of 9 1a degrees. But the general trend over the next few days is for things to stay relatively quiet. We will keep some showers along the east coast but elsewhere clear skies and its going to be a chilly start to monday morning. At the same time there is a risk of more into every pushing to the south east corner but that said, generally its going to be a dry day on monday for many of us, despite that rain in the south east and temperatures will peak at 950 degrees. 9 15. Welcome to bbc news. Im james reynolds. Our top stories donald tusk receives a formal request to delay brexit from the british Prime Minister. Borisjohnson was forced to make the request after a bruising defeat in westminster. He says its a mistake. Dozens of arrests in azerbaijan as Anti Government protesters and opposition leaders demand democratic reform. And a curfew is about to go into force in chile after two days of violent protests in the capital