Transcripts For ALJAZ Inside 20240703

Kind of walk into the program on the phone for the 1st time since, as well as war on guns. It began and ill tell you. But joe biden has admitted the american weapons have been used to kill civilians, and hes president of stop supplying this wish of being part of the United States is f as to secure israel. The comments are the strongest warning yet by the us president over a potential ground invasion. A rafa by is riley forces. More than one and a half 1000000 palestinians have taken shelter there off to fleeing from northern gauze. Despite consistent and vote cool, us opposition is around, has continued bombing the southern city. And now the space palestinians are being ordered to leave rafa the process of being held across the american universities against the gods. The world is killed nearly 35000 people, and some democrats, so being pressuring biden to do more to stop is rails of violence. So is bidens warnings is rattling the attempt to calm down and go home as he seeks and all the time in office in 6 months time. Oh will he indeed weak the tool and take tough of action against the Benjamin Netanyahu . Government looks full this on all the issues with, i guess, 1st this report by culture lopez or the young, are forced to slee yet again, this family has nowhere to go. They are among thousands of palestinians leaving areas and rasa as israel plants, a full scale attack. Once a city of refuge from more than 1500000 people, its now a target. Well, little bit ran over how good the plot they are bombarding us, threatening us and telling us to leave. But we have nowhere else to go. Personally, i have no one to turn to the house. My mother is dead and i have no one else. The us is adding unprecedented pressure to stop and assault, having once pledged unconditional support for israel president ial bite and has value to stop getting israel weapons. If it invades rougher civilians have been killed in gaza, so consequences of those bombs and other ways in which they go after populations. I made it clear that if i go into rough or i havent gone on roughly yet, going a rough or im not supplying the weapons that have been used historically to deal with ralph. Good, more to move is seen by many as a warning because of defense, secretary lloyd austin confirmed washington has already paused a shipment of weapons. Israel should launch a major attack in or off or without accounting for and protecting the civilians that are in the rental space. The us is by far, israels a big a supplier of weapons with Congress Last month approving 26000000000. 00 and extra funding. Even so biting is getting pushed back from members of his own party and months ahead of the president ial election. Hes also being criticized by students who states protest against funding the war. We will not stop and defending the students until there is an immediate permanent c, sorry that includes complete withdraw. It is really forces from gaza and the release of all hostages. People with under pressure at home and abroad is really Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says, an assault on or off or isnt needed to defeat thousands of them off fighters. A fight hes previously said will move forward with or without the ceasefire deal. And with or without support from allies who will have to be sure we have already proven in the previous release of hostile to that military pressure on how much is necessary now 7 months into the war on gaza. Palestinians and russell wait to see of heighten political pressure on israel will have an effect on the ground, katia a little bit so that again, i will do 0 for insights. Story. Okay, lets bring it out. I guess scott lucas is a professor of International Politics with the University College dublins clinton institute. Hes with us from week low in island and amman to heidi most stuff. As a senior paula stein list with the n G O International crisis group, she joins us from. Im on. I met, i am a klein, so Political Science professor, i bought a Land University whos with us from west jerusalem, a bible, and welcome to all 3 of you. Thank you very much for your time met of him. I wonder if i can start with you 35000 people, dead men, women, and children. Whats made motivated joe biden to issue these threats now as opposed to previously when it could have saved many more lives. A very good question. I am watching today. Seeing an interview i expected today, this question to be a follow up by the presenter, but she said not to make it. Well, i know, isnt it too late . But its better now than never. Its better late than never. So it saves that p. Im very good support for is right and is called they should the i like what we have sold, it will be or its, im condition them or the statements they coming from the state. So this right, so i think its a condition that simple. If this call dish, and if this condition with the, if they say the reason the american fetal or the issue is one of the operation of the, there is another feed though, well, destroyed the expense, eh, eh, before is where the ex, escalation of the war into north and may be the americans with co rich European Countries to recognize the state of the spine and may be late. Their america would not have told you and Security Council for a accepted exhibit. But the state to further stand as a poor member in the way all these are expected we, we should keep in mind that this can be the next steps that by then we use, again, a split, the neo but the out is lucky to keep up. Let me take this question to 2 scouts because the met him is basically imply that but a sooner than later um buttons, exact words were quote, it would be wrong to send military support a is where a right now come we spell out scott so that there was no doubt what americas fee is all surrounding israel is pushed into rafa. Given the information that was pretty much already started, dozens of people have been killed as strikes are on the way to the by the ministrations doing. In the specific case. A proffer is there drawing a distinction between those on go. Busy and is really air strikes, which as you mentioned, are causing a couple of dozen categories each day in rough uh, and the ground, the sol as far as when israel earlier this, we carried out another series of deadly assaults on or off from here. And what we thought of ground today, she might be on an american official, immediately went to the meeting and said, all these werent significant military operations. In other words, we werent going to ask because of these bible specific words. When he, you know, issued supposedly the red line is a major ground assault. So in other words, israel continues with the present operations but stopped short of what would be an invasion of russell, where you have those 1400000 people who are at risk. Then the americans will not take action further action terms, especially on military aid. The question is, of course, does better than at yahoo and perhaps even more importantly, defenseless for your lot. No. The, remember the origin. Do they want to proceed with that ground today . Even though you have the risk of sharply increasing civilian casualties and the increasing the risk that the by the ministration will find where be forced to take a step regarding the alternatives as to how do you know what i need to buy didnt make the threat of withdrawing military support, but he also made a very, very important comments as well mainly that american shipments of weapons have been used by israel to pill civilians in gauze. And thats quite an admission. He seems to be referring to those high payload musicians, a munitions, namely 2000 pound bomb shipments of which we know were bound last week, one says this admission this acknowledgement, say to you, i mean, its always, yes, it is insignificant, but again, this is just a little public clustering from the us administration. This is coming against the backdrop of the on the growing Public Defense at home. The fact that on, you know, you have to visions within guidance on how to you. This is coming against a gaming rhetorical campaign for president ial elections. In the us, but more importantly, the us as dining internationally has seen a come see, you know, down tightest. I mean, we can talk about how is all it is, is perceived as an international prior. But the fact that the us so far has affected as well. And its also ongoing that hasnt been lost on International Audiences either. And not to mention about that. Also, on the 7th of may, just recently, we saw the biggest, i guess differently, to cover the u. S, as in henry uh, in defense of israel, which is about how must have been the sole obstacle to a ceasefire, which from us did accept those terms. It was this one that rejected it. I went ahead with its invasion reference, and in that time, yes, we may see things like big statements as the type of items already made. These folks as far as opposed to, to wait for it to be delayed, to your, to your object sports, but that doesnt take away from the fact that the us has supplied israel consistently since the 7th of october, which huge amounts of stuff, hows weapons does that that just last month we saw the us provided with, with another supplemental aid package. Again, its going to be added to the machine. So its pretty easy to use and not in that sense, right . Its only about drops in the ocean. Lets look into a little bit more detail, let us ministry funding to israel, which has been increased since the beginning of the war and gaza. President biden signed a 15000000000. 00 war assistance package last month. Thats over and above the 38000000000. 00 military aid commitment across 10 years as part of an agreement signed back in 2016. As this type of the 70s to us as deliberate. 5th, the shipments of arms more than a 130. 00 cargo planes loaded with weapons to israel without him. What kind of weapons are we talking about the us now . Whole thing of these offensive, or defensive weapons, what level of support would be would choose would for instance, israels, im dont be affected as far as i understand this weapons can l. O is ray of 8 o. Fools to boom, calendars and above the houses. Civilian houses, civic civilian institutions, under which there are condoms. This was made in the war. Theyve got the door fed center got a got a street already by his room. Detail souls is right, a pretty fair as well from the air. All the toners stand off and 3 boats on the ground. Its on the other ground uh to get the risk of a of the soldiers is where the soldiers. So we felt that these boards is rent controlled to be with her boss fish taking shelter of the ground in the essays with the seals. So its very, very clear that the operation is blocked off that, that the general itself is driven. Golf is impossible with this, a bar go, all right, on default. So let me throw this to you. Does this now mean that we could see, is there a, the forces acting even more indiscriminately, whether operation and roughly if thats what my absolutely want to push on with. The fact here is just to follow up on your previous question to talk about, you know, where we are. You know, that the us assistance is being held up to israel, at least temporarily. Now were talking about 2000 pound bonds. Were talking about 500. 00 terminals, the types of bonds as a re destruction of a civilian areas, for example, in the initial stages of the assaults and no other jobs. So were talking about, were told jaden ups, which converts supposedly and got involved to try to these are office of the weapons. The issue here, however, is as an american official, already knowledge is that the israel already passed. And all of these weapons that had been supplied by the United States to go into the office. It wants to. Now for that reason, id say, you know, the cohort fact here is that the initiative is still not with washington. The initiative is still with the as relative workshop. The americans have been trying to do the international community. Ive been trying for months to try to influence or cabinet in particular with talks with the father members, the work cabinet besides Benjamin Netanyahu, your, to launch the defense minister, been against the former head of the shortly military. And i cant tell you at this point whether or not the ground a visual go ahead because the calculations will be made down right on the basis of what the u. S. Has done. But on the basis that is really the most, you can try your emotional goes to school, you mentioned to the psycho j, the Mission Missiles used to convert and guide to bottom. So shes saying to position weapons, i bring this up because one can ask that member has tweeted, her name is tiny gold live saying that so the country should simply revert to using quote in precise ms solves to quote, flatten 10 buildings. I mean, even simulation, there is give us the weapons that will kill who we want. Well, i mean that type of ultimatum, this is an ultimatum which is just coming from the hard. Right . And israel included inside the drawer such as minister, been who there is actually come from the saw because remember what he said to ship this to the political dimension as well. You know, if you dont agree to a cease fire, were going to go and draw. Were going to go ahead and effectively watch every wow. Then of course, with, im not study really creating the degree to cease fire if the position of all right, put up or shot what the username is immediately do. This project to mazda is acceptance of the cease fire, and leave us with the open question we have right now. There are diversity of voices, and if you have the sports that you can pick up from people who are ready to de populate casa web, no interest is a very large, whatsoever. But i think were all set to recognize that there are a lot of is riley so far concerned about the direction of this water station. Some of them are concerned about the fact that in the a small there is no sign of in any day, no side of certainly a resolution level a trial. There are some are concerned because of course we dropped a 130. 00 hostages and the bodies of hostages to match the holes. And we have some who are generally not concerned about the fact that this more isnt on jo store. And i think the more that we recognize that diversity, okay, and it is really relevant. Just simply say it is inevitable that the hard right is going to lead, nothing yahoo, down the path into the destruction. Bravo. I say, you know, its a better way of appreciating where things might go. I realized one thing, or i think the key determiner right here is money. Always personal position because of the day that theres a cease fire and gust his political future is probably all becomes there will be early elections in the day that there is a speech for. And joshua is legal feature will be in jeopardy because of the possibilities youll be on trial on broadway charges. And i think that might be the price in such a while or be an attack on roster. Sure. But not him. So what were looking at is either way, the beginning of the end for Benjamin Netanyahu. How much genuine concern just to add to what scott said, is that in israel about the withdrawal of military supplies or position liter, yall are please let the it is blaming destiny all his quote failed management for bidens new stance. Meanwhile, the far right extreme, right National Security minister, its my bank, give me via tweeting that quote from us, loves bind and what are these comments say about sort of using this well . Sadly, and then very sad to say that that the issue in the mainstream and is much me a worried about. Busy his red america relations, the lives of people in guys. Im very sad to say that, but this, this is the way i see the guy in the period statements. They are already about the future relations. So the present relations between israel and the american, not the ministration and this mores they, for the Public Opinion, much, much more than the war in guys a different fast. The majority of this really support going to offer it for the americans are not objective. Ok with the american objection, it may be there is a shift in Public Opinion in frame for off at the very base really public is not informed enough on here. What was, what was how, what was suggested by c, i a director at the accept the, the best buy from us. But the information is, is this is really bad stream it to this Media Information channels. They dont say what was exactly suggested and what is the price . That is what i should pay in order to get to becketts of the just right. Lets move this conversation to a bit further on and, and focus on it what, how all of this plays out in the United States. Because given the growing opposition to the war in the us and given the, you know, the elephant in the room, the growing blooming attention thats being focused on the full coming president ial election. How long do we think the honey joe biden has before he desperately needs to see results . I. E. And then to this conflict before it starts to post serious political damage to bidens future. I think its already come to that stage now in terms of the way that we seem Public Opinion in the us time, completely against the sliding administration. You know, where youve seen the majority of Public Opinion support. Does the sorry cost in the network at the moment and in terms of whats going on. So i think weve already reached that stage, but i think more critically the question is, how much impunity the us is going on . That isnt okay, wait a minute. We can have this clustering as much as we want to be invited to ministration, but ultimately binder along with others. A Certain Senior us officials and his administration, including the structure of the state, have continuously spencer sounds of october. The i embraced israel, i have hoped to need a better what has been happening. And despite the original lines, despite the golf house that were seeing, which constant shift by the way, israel now so well that it can continue to do what it wants with something. Impunity, it knows full well that it can get away with, with whatever it wants. It can get away, pushing the message, right, lines and even even as brightens domestic support. I can do sort continues on the decline. It already is. Right. Uh scott uh, honey made a interesting point that these red lines just seemed to be and so movable theyve cease to have any meaning whatsoever. How come though, in the context of this decision, by, by that how kind of he and the democrats fend off republican criticism, for instance, from the likes of senior republicans, such as mitch mcconnell, who are framing bidens threats to reduce the home supplies, quote, eating him, us sometimes in politics you have got a difficult choice between doing what is politically expedient for domestic reasons and doing the right. Moral and ethical entity practical say. When it comes to what is happening to your problem, there is no doubt that its abide in ministration. Takes a firm so against israel, that it will be heavily criticized by republicans by trumpets. Indeed donald trump has taken a break from his trial in new york to tweet this morning about joe biden. And she just mentioned be a friend from austin, a supporter of terrorist. But you have a question for the by the administration, which is on the one hand, if you love this, you know, you will be criticized if you draw a line with these writers after they have defied previous objections to a grand defense of noble in jostling objections to it standing out a pensive across all the dresser objections to their attacks on a workers, you will be a time for that. But on the other hand, if you let this trial, if you give is real estate for what is effectively open ended war into the summer and naturally are you will continue to see in a row sion of your support from those who might, might normally support you on domestic issues in an Election Year as were seeing in the protest across america. Yeah. Lets talk about the come back to the. Yeah, lets talk about those protests if we may. Yeah, its a hyundai, of course. They all the backdrop to all of these decisions being made by washington dose. This move by, by and do you think goes some way in vindicating those protest as yeah, i think the majority, yes, it does speak to to what these protestors ultimately i trying to, to advocate for. But again, that really dont say much if its not followed up by serious practical steps. And by that when youre serious cost on israel, you know, is always to know that will be consequences for its actions. If it does not need to go beyond just the metrics. Yeah. And i, i dont think again, i dont think that is going to be lost on these purchases, especially considering the way that we seen public, im sorry, popular public, a protests that have been severely come down upon. I mean, the, these purchased, these students have been met with insane amounts of police brutality. You know, i mean, its, its absolutely shocking, i think. And if anything its, its actually ended up from the adverse effects of ashburn, when in a more, you know, global is my. But again, i left the she followed with any serious action. I dont think thats going to be lost in the furthest of. Yeah. Honey, its a very powerful sense of pessimism about the meaning of this move by bite, and im gonna knock him i want if i can, ill ask you this. If were going to see if there was any results from any of these threats to comp military aid, we may well see them in the way which negotiations play out to in the egypt and car ro, mazda. So we know has signed up to a proposal, including an exchange of captives for soldiers and a pump, a permanent end to hostilities, as well as we know has not come to us. Do anything to put its foot down further than just the threat to cup military aid to force a deal . Yeah, it is. The us can go much beyond what the embargo on bobs um that it stated us can look feet though in the us, secure with the call. So the best thing ever a request to be a former member of the state to buy this thing to become a former member of the un. Okay . Us cannot cartridge or gave green light to west European Countries to recognize the state of palestine. The the us can go much further publicly but not just the briefing. The new york dougs correspondence about its relations. They bear by the relations with bethany all but make statements to explain this really Public Opinion what they think about them. Yeah, and right. Yeah. Its the United States, is that the neo or jewel, by the right. Let me off this thing probably all last question here to, to score because might not come raised to an interesting point island where you are now, i understand is going to be one country together with spain. As the vacuum of that is poor is to recognize the state of palestine is not leave a necessary to be pulled at the moment in order to show is ro, water growing chorus of countries around the world. Think of this situation. I think its a necessary moral and political stop because until you recognize the state of palestinians, palestine, how can you ever expect palestinians have the respect to have the empowerment that they will be listened to and acknowledge otherwise, theyre just a state where people need the implication of this is the previous question, this should the us coming in behind the recognition of the state of palestine. Absolutely. Will that be enough to stop the minute is really assault or offer any open ended more . No United States, if it was serious stops, i mean really serious stuff is putting pressure on in terms of getting a ceasefire with 1st of all make clear that it has no objections to a cease fire even if the is rarely subject to it. Secondly, the americans would stay in the side of the lease and hopefully supported the strips through the u. S. And indeed through the International Criminal court to help israel accountable if it does to, to do this war. And certainly United States with finally ready player wants them for all that. The israelis do not have a detail over the future of the palestinians, whether it be in jobs on were in the west. Uh, okay. Okay. Scott lucas, to her name was stuff. Uh, madeline klein. It is being a pleasure to speak to all 3 of you here on inside story many thanks for your time. And thank you. Of course for watching you can see the program again any time by visiting our website out there and dont com for further discussion. Go to a facebook page. Thats facebook dot com, forward slash a j inside story. You can also join the conversation on x. Ill handle is up asia inside story. I mean the focus on the whole team here, pitts, bye for now. The after a controversial president ial campaign. And the contested victory proposed to be unto is said to lead indonesia, Southeast Asia is the largest economy that drive us nation with more than 1300. 00 ethnic groups for that to go. While were comfortable with the people, were not going to be determined by for in none of the president s alexis, indonesia, proposed to be unto chokes, to, ill just be around the on counting the cost is real installation defense as tech, a whole trade for the nation. So one of the economic costs of buying on palestinian watkins in israel is all pending, labors, livelihoods, popular new weight loss trucks reshape the industry, counting the cost on alexs era. The hello, im sorry, im the wising and doha, just a quick look at the main stories. Now. Is there any forces or expanding attacks on causes region of rough uh, huge plumes of smoke that was seen over the biggest city in the south. More than a 100000 palestinians have fled the area in just 5 days. The United Nations is saying these riley army take over the roof of border crossing, is crippling humanitarian operations. Unit, such as Food Supplies of foss, running out, and the child, dest must be prevented, have sent us no, no, no, no, no one of the