His zimbabwe weve seen. The government hes going to turn down to. Forced off their properties 20 years ago but is this enough to resolve one of those divisive policies for the euro this is inside story. Hello welcome to the program i am hashem. They shoe of who owns the land in zimbabwe is controversial 2 decades ago former president Robert Mugabe violently evicted thousands of white farmers and gave the properties to black families has said he wants to address colonial imbalances but critics on the view the policy destroyed the economy. Successor. Appears to be trying to make amends his government says 14 white farmers can apply to have the land back given a different plot it follows an agreement in july to pay 3500000000 dollars in compensation when god was 1st made the promise in 2017 just after president mugabe was forced from office. Well. Known. For a very. Very birth government is going to go. From. There is a law. The 1st term to distribute land more fairly started in 1980 that was when zimbabwe gained independence from white minority rule and most arab land was owned by white farmers under the policy of the government did not force the sale of land but into a 1000 former president mugabe began forcibly seizing areas from white farmers the move triggered controversy inside zimbabwe and was can down by the International Community by 2009 ugly culture revenues dropped by 12000000000. 00 some sectors later recovered with zimbabwes Tobacco Sales reaching record levels in 2018. Lets bring in our panel all joining us from harare joining us on the phone vince morris servia an economist and Investment Consultant obert good to is a former spokesman for the movement for Democratic Change as zimbabwean Opposition Party and with joyce gwen year is a political analyst welcome to all of you vince what is the government trying to do who or is it trying to reverse mortgages land reform or just backtracking on some aspects of it. I think there is no factual you know i think someone just created that narrative there is no reversal of the land reform would those individuals were example then and of the reform the land to not be taken back the policy is very clear right number one those properties that were protected by the bilateral investment promotion protection act we entered into really into agreement with International Countries who then sent foreigners to invest in land those people will get their land back right and number 2 they are black farmers who had title. Prior to 2100 taken over and they also are entitled to get their farms back that is the only thing that is happening at the state so this narrative that is being reversed is not correct all right let me go to over over to your party has been talking about this particular issue in the past and it seems that this is quite a delicate issue to the point where the government started with compensation in july and now is talking about returning land dancing that were talking just about very special cases was does the m. D. C. Stand here. I look nice sound i guess planted fine for the benefit of the us im a former special im with him on this us as one of the empty seats and sticking it in my ear beat up by 6 years of what its all analysts so that use im not teaching it to add mind you its let me also has that thats why does not happen is actually the one of the fed to call at s. And i is s. And all the lenders on progress as up cause to best out of the lender oh are we all over member is simply that lender follow Program Needs above as such at and this at the tannenbaum of the new millennium and i dont see yet 2000 and salvias the do a lot of other issues that sadly ive been in that i noticed in sadie consistently there i havent thought that all of the in the sense is indeed in a civil language does that mean im talking about your legs and your. Quack that its using their own planet meads we all be giving up the land of progress some of them head toss that i havent yet i had they had those clowns come out of the 5 acts by the estates intends on the land that is this axe and the last one and all its on and that it wasnt called that be bought it by and ill invest cements ramos and protection not prevent its head and these scientists well sort of 2nd all up by the stakes during one sets and the other set up the lead on Program Every 2nd of the new millennium so what that got them and if they do we now dont is to try to read sandy cheap to. Well long green recently. He has a land phone problem i certainly didnt make any sense to you before we. Entered the g. P. S. He. Bandaged ended up and taken away from him so thats it but im not going to. Teach them. A lot of it while im at the doctor im not anybody in excess oil. Ok rejoiced you must have heard of other talking about the government trying to bring russia to the landrieu Redistribution Program by Robert Mugabe but when you look at what has been happening over the last few months the government saying initially were just company in the white farmers for the infrastructure that was put in place in the land that was taken away from them now theyre talking about compensation but this saying that it does not mean that we are going to necessarily bring them back of their own parcels but were trying to find other turner to of land for them why is the government very cautious about how to move forward. Well then to the course of caution because we stated many many years ago. You know where looting Property Rights you treat a whole domino effect of lawlessness so i dont see how theyre going to be able to do to repair the damage you know the point is that this is 20 years down the line notion and i think most farmers really have moved on and to say you got to you have got to be going around scrounging around the world and looking for finance to compensate the optics i dont agree we vincent and all that the optics on the ground up to that there is a vis of expropriation without competition because this is the ideology that mugabe propounded. Of checking basic from the koran at least and giving it back to the beckmann its also on the ground the optics of that to that is being the best so it is taking a lot of effort for this government explain itself and were never this government has explained this is a government that is it lawful you know record of Human Rights Violations they do not you know i did in the constitution they dont keep their own laws so it would be surprising to see these guys putting this through but i think that on the ground this is why the war veterans just had it at the media center were sending this signal that it is that if this all and im sure that this is the kind of damage that has kept me just go to change events in terms of what ted the signal is on the ground action then sea of just heard what rejoice has been saying basically this is a reverse of this is backtracking on a narrative the has been prevailing for that case in zimbabwe vats mugabe has been trying to address and the star economists take by colonialism now what kind of message is the government sending to the zimbabweans who have. Coming off land owners well you know the the missing is basically nothing much is going to change in the wood no white farmer says different farmers are going to be given then you know if youre very clear that i also want to rejoice there was never in the agreement postindependence thanks for speaking without titian this me very clear on that in the lancaster house agreement there was that dream and on the period after which the government would acquire the land and build the fund as would be the british in whatever way it happened and then obviously that didnt happen the reason why we had gone back to this mentality or Big Corporation without compensation was that the house and land reform was actually carried out that was never the intention even constitutionally currently we have a constitution that can not only just that farmers have to complete their constitution but 95 percent approval by only bubbling so i think at this stage theres a lot of emotion and a lot of confusion and this lets be very clear that different categories of people know black farmer was located in length for example and. To farmers that is going to be taken aback then that is not going to happen ok so that you do so but to me you know this is this is really tearing emotional Free Independent from independent there was never in agreement of experimentation with you know with the well listen to gentleman i feel like this is a chaotic process that needs to be smooth and finalized in a way or another all but now i understand when you say this is something which has been done carefully authority to bring about a genuine change to the legacy of bigotry now the question is is president m. S. And one guy trying to pivot away from the legacy of Robert Mugabe what is he just doing this. For the International Reputation of his own country i dont have to look at you and look at to see it is that a president of the land and one is governments as you not only ever granted themselves as that as the 2nd republic you know you look at the optics to say yes. As the 2nd government scientists distinctly defense yet it sounds from. One of them and then call the 1st public and about and got it where it is say the we are the 2nd public we have to be seen to be doing things differently being the people who are obeying a and out of all of that data sets up the law and its meant to market whether they dont theyre trying to do is to say this is the law of the land in zimbabwe or in the constitution and it has been since i didnt write it and when that out is consistent i know that dr epps. May 20th bedsit not as i meant to think the sense of the people over what it actually what did yes so it wasnt all the lonely up tooled up of the new constitution us about with the constitution i used. And let me ask and ed that its insult sex ed to 95 that particular constitution that now uses it to mrs bed earlier that all those people who are all indigenous about it or put a different date to call when you sort of kind of disadvantaged it often is a city is that like it without any effect on the op or choir had their fun its what i add to the unset of the lead from programming they enter the thousands who said ready to go out to be besides those people all im going to hear the an inland he tends to them and instead confidence with that land can no longer be tended to them then they will meet you there and compensate us and foreign competitors and that its economists our gov who writes for what land ok then groom and on that rent this is actually different for my wife. Dogs or be compensated and if you look at that women that are settled it and signed it in the bank if stocks above comments are simple improvements on the spot and not to the net so it will go i mentioned that we would go back to that aspect and talk a little bit about some of its details rejoice there is a difference between bring it about a change because you are genuine a ballot. Change and doing this just because youre feeling the hate or the International Pressure theres no investment coming to the country no international the backing of the government and therefore theyre presenting this somehow a window dressing to say you know what this is a post mugabe era absolutely you know. Its interesting because. To overcome it you turned 70 of course he got some regular tory. Changes in there for instance tempering around with us internet now my point really i keep on making the point that it basically the Property Rights a clause in the constitution are very contradictory there are many reasons why even the m. D. C. That you know allow this thing to go through obviously youd be kinder to it we dont have much time to talk about that but you know the detail started this process this tree got its days up so to no way this government can be able to raise your point 5000000000. 00 of your own so this is a talking thing a shim the emotion and the sec or lets go destruction that this thing caused theres no capacity to pay back so the farmers are gone vince the economist and listener some simple math here. Youve heard rejoicing that basically where where is the government going to get the 3500000000. 00 to for the compensation and how are you going to allocate new parcel land for those who are going to be can potatoes or given that of land youre talking about a mammoth task within the very heart of an unprecedented unprecedented financial crisis. Yeah absolutely make let me start a beginning. This is obviously 03 p. A little just look at it as that and issue because we have always said that if you remove the land issue we are actually going to trigger economic recovery because you know 70 percent of the mother population is dependent under culture and in direct addition to to industry 60 percent of industry inputs come from agriculture right so the idea does not stop with. Giving people back to them and also has to be productive so lets be clear that this is a big idea to say how do we actually attract Foreign Exchange interest in public and why dont we detected agriculture so that we cannot trust money coming into zimbabwe and we can check that the economy clearly the international the International Market different place now and its not going to be easy to actually raise the money but in my view its not going to be impossible either because let me give you an example in the last 2 years alone we had what a coke a month agriculture yeah ok the government is actually spent about 5000000000. 00 on the command agriculture with this truck to deal with the private sector was able to come in and actually fund culture so you know im not pessimistic about the possibility of actually raising the money and remain but to the people who are going to cook compensated have got some kind of network internationally who actually also want also to see this thing you know come to an end so i think if the government and the farmers get together they can possibly raise that that thats money what is also important yes i think that it is i think rejoice is correct in that the issue of implementation by this government has always been questionable so we are not saying this is everything you know hunky dorey this is double. When you work out theres a lot of conflicts of interest theres a lot of underhand deal how do we ensure for example that ministers who got 7 forms i think end up with one form is reported to have been pumped and who get the 7. 61 that they didnt get allocated to the black people to the direct path of orders rule and the love that usually what we did come through the white commercial farmers in zimbabwe is invariably that israel must be allowed to participate in agriculture and and of equivocation to present. The zimbabwe is skeptical concerned about some of the framing that is taking place as we speak in the country like those who are the proponents of the or the supporters of the of the returning land to the white farmers are saying that we have to do with because we are no longer selfsufficient the way we used to be prior to thousands of black farmers will tell you at the same time we are not to blame because we are paying the price of decades of marginalization. The same. Problem we. Did. There is no denying that each of us came out because you would be having sheep for just living month and you can bet they choose to go and chipping away their gifts and wind coming up i must say we have taken over and they took over so why did the government is sending the money situation i asked a lot of question to that that we not in the us and so it is not just the nation and i said in terms of descending on this i didnt mean that their white counterparts that shoe on the center are shut the company that makes the leg from cross is easy about it is your mouth to call glen on it is a fact that some people actually on similar farms believes any part of one politically well connected funny that wants not less than 23 or 24 commercial farms in prime land most of you didnt land in. Oz about and these are the issues that land on tickets and a little bit of rest its all right thats so shes lost at the end of it and besides the mocha look at them possessed and object to being sent our lady shes into i see a fine rejoice were talking about as if this is going to suddenly change the face of the country to the better but we forget of the same time but zimbabwe is thats have to deal with severe drought shelters in foreign currency and that heart of the population is food in secure so whats the way forward to address the economic crisis in the country and to change the Living Standards for the people for the better. Or to question it as a. Liberal activist myself i do appreciate the direction that actually the government is taking acknowledging. And the importance of their private Property Rights thats very important because it other than the op the negative walked. In the ground the group you know a signal is very positive in the sense that for the 1st time you know all the Foreign Direct Investment in business and in terms of partner has to have some kind of hope that this government is going to have the regular action but that is more pushing off of the panacea because we still need to do it midterms husham of human rights how do you invest in a country where these wrist you know where people are kidnapped with theres no rule of law oh we shout as for that you get of it but my doubt is that to the other things you need for technique ok human rights i see a point vance this is going to be my last question to you this is a country that obviously needs to more denies its economic sector it has to move forward at the same time as the choice was saying it has also to change politically to open up the political establishment and to reach out to the opponents and to the critics all of these factors. We havent no indication whatsoever from the government that is it is genuine to pave the way for every fiber and democracy yet we are all very concerned because some of us have been saying you know talking about what needs to happen we need a totally new Economic Vision the way we are doing things right now is that we basically took over the interest of framework and the behavior from god with their cultures and ways of doing things their way entrenched over a 38 year period and youre not going to change that over 2 years no i you going to change the language because you can even see some of the language of politicians that is the same language that used to be that we all force again we need a paradigm shift and to move that current im sure youre not going to happen is the politicians continue arguing about one deciding one by side and then bubbles are not part of the solution thats why i am quick to jump into we need actually a Marshall Plan but that muscle planted only happen when the private sector when the government when labor and when people come to the table and change a new vision of an inclusive good public that creates an inclusive economy because if you continue doing what were doing we are not going to create new results so we need to change the people making decisions we need to change the structures in the institutional structure and clean up on old mindset that actually are risky progress in this country since a survey of a good 200 choice gwenny thank you very much for your time and for your insight. And thank you too for watching you can see the program again any time by visiting our website www dot com for further discussion go to our Facebook Page thats facebook dot com forward slash a. J. Inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter our hand there is a j inside story from me and the entire team here in doha by phone now. 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