But he wanted to control they be a by force now the hospital is off to a political solution and egypts president has laid out a mission to deploy a series of military victories by the un recognized government in libya but will this proposal even be considered this is inside story. Hello and welcome to the program im Laura Brennan libyas warlord how if i have to aim to seize power by force you have the support of russia egypt and the u. A. E. And everything was going well for him until last month he suffered major blows in his battle to capture the capital tripoli as planned unseat the un recognized government base that collapsed have to its military losses were accelerated by turkeys military intervention in support of Government Forces after all has long resisted compromise bonce now hes ready to talk hes accepted a ceasefire plan for opposed by his ally the egyptian president up till fattah elsisi that would start on monday it would include foreign fighters leaving libya. Come out ahead even with our daughter ella dominant im sitting at the Initiative Aims to guarantee a fair representation of libyas 3 provinces in a president ial council elected by the people under the supervision of the United Nations it will manage libyas leadership for the 1st time in the countrys history and unite all libyan institutions this will enable them to play their role and guarantee fair and transparent distribution of libyan resources for all citizens the initiative will prevent extremist groups or militias from taking over the states resources it will also entail a constitutional declaration that would regulate the upcoming political and electoral obligations will have to has blames libyas deepening divisions on turkeys support for the internationally recognized government in that the one who took the 1st year i leave me to intervention deepens the state of internal polarization by supporting the unconstitutional government of National Accord with more weapons and fighters it also depends on the state of international and regional polarisation around libya and lot of the conflicting interests among most of the countries involved in this conflict well libyas un recognized government has rejected the truce force our forces allies to it say theyll press on to reclaim territory from me for half done hes still in control of the east and much of the self whether a Major Oil Fields but Government Forces are now closing in on sirte the last major region before the traditional boundary between libyas west and its east that of violence has come off the Government Forces controlled areas surrounding the capital tripoli theyve also seized the city of the huna after the last stronghold in the west they reversed the course of half hours offensive on tripoli in may when they captured a base. Thank you lets bring in our guests now and joining us here today we have jim ill go mattie in london hes the special envoy of the Libyan Government of National Accord to tunisia algeria morocco and mauritania here in doha omar sure hes a founding chair of the so of the Security Studies program at the institute for graduate studies and from brussels james run former European University egypt jordan and yemen and is also the e. U. Senior coordinator in libya during the 2011 revolution a very warm welcome to all of you jim let me start with you today why has the g. N. A. T. Rejected this call for a cease fire on monday by sisi and after. Because this is a cold one sided corner by egypt imposing thinks on libya without any consultation whatsoever these sides to the conflict in libya are many the g. N. A. T. Is an important part also the house of representatives or parliament which sits atop brooke has many many of its members far more than though those who supported half there and he is im now sitting in tripoli for the last over a year and have their own leadership also there is another state council in tripoli these institutions are these do shows which came out of the libyan political agreement these are the recognize is that you should by the International Community to janni is that argument is government by the International Community all these are sites today a conflict that has a fork and initiative only one side it only consult it would have to and im not consulting with the other sites or even telling them that its going to launch an initiative this cannot be a fair and Just Initiative from an honest broker and initiatives ok this is a unilateral call for a cease fire to present that was if he ever really believe that the d. N. A. Would accept it. It is very difficult to say what the believe the. Basically the initiative is noise in the background its egypt. d or home and see government does not have a monitor that the with d the many sides of the even some sides within the. Tax on the west on intervention. The problem being the tripolis since august 24th dean. The support for the fuel offensive wired you were doing a Peace Process why are they you and secretary general was in talks with heft. And all the developments that have been on that that theres not really given the political credibility to be the peacemaker in the ending that it was not a it was actually a sport that for a sustained supporter that for the peace for process and for many of the u. N. Backed efforts now you know to come out of that and the polls you know the offensive failed and now the commentary offensive is focusing well reaching now. To come at this point and propose an demobilization and disarmament process later that really the ginning that d. N. A. Who successfully did stop the offensive and then wants the consequences to tell them now and over your weapons to a socalled enemy that no one needed a good night is there to get him on except the egyptians of the op these and some of the other backers its like a its straight a noise in the background so who would take this seriously in any way. Yeah theres a lot in the cairo declaration that i want to get into in in just a moment but before we do james as want to get an idea from you whether you were surprised to see this strong man this renegade military general who he thought have to us standing somewhat neatly beside thesea asking for a cease fire well i dont think he had much choice and being clearly the military scales weighed against him more than 2 months hes been losing territory losing evolutions and west. Is because of the offensive spare or one of the options that i missed the half of those circumstances. Probably to try to get some breathing space. Whether through a ceasefire or whether other means but i agree with the other speakers egypt is not best place to make this Initiative Given its past support promise after and a lot of contact between egypt and the g. O. P. And certainly there and indeed the janet backers is a real problem of course between turkey and egypt in the wider region and turkey is an absolutely key player in all of this you know a serious attempt to peace and its going to be why do you think then it was egypt that came forward with this and not the u. A. E. Or not russia or or any of other supporters. Well i want to start the egypt consulted with the russians that they are artists and others before doing it it may not have been leaderships idea couldnt somebody elses idea that egypt being a neighboring arab country but it obviously a key interest understandably in the stability in their view or. An opinion. Or put down the least worst position as it were 2 of Us Initiative but i do agree with the other speakers this is not an initiative there which is that it has much stamina much legs and i dont know how worried should egypt be d. N. A. Advance across the east and towards the oil fields. A not sure but worried that im not sure about the ability i dont think the current government in egypt once the type of stability that the un and many of the other International Community members want defense yes collation followed by some sort of the mobilization reigns in the senate i think. Which was a very very weak is that even though i was a bit critical of it because the study ambitious talking about what would have the weapons in 60 days which was extremely on the other 6 but anyway it is a book framework i dont think egypt wants that framework because the type of the regime the type of regime that would use is not the type of the gene that egypt wants. Basically a framework for a constitutional democracy with peaceful transition of power and some sort of. I wouldnt say federalism because its a its a contentious were written they give us some sort of the essential i think an awful hour from the center to the to the other 2 through the different regions. That sort of regime is the antithesis of what egypt has at the moment. So it wont embrace this kind of stuff but it would actually would fight to create instability then could use a similar regime time to what it wants which is basically a former general some sort of Flash Forward for north. That is that takes over the country the problem with that method is that egypt actually has the firepower it has a minute city that that stayed intact and 2 since probably 154. 00 to the exact was more or less controlled in the Political Economic and security and minutes of the ethics of the country and india does not have that what it has is a full selfdefense or Even National army was basically on my. A bunch of military defectors slash warlords a group of tribal militias all that but together and with international mercenaries profession the worst marries and tribal militias that are known to be from sudan from chat so that coalition really does not have enough manpower or firepower do it to equal some sort of a military dictatorship. Such as one in egypt so what happened is that if these if the last the combat. I mention and based on the losses of the convert that i mentioned were now seeing the political unfolding but the population egypt. And they and their theyve been on the show and were Different Reasons than that. Lets talk a little closer look at this cairo declaration m. O. Is talking about foreign fighters being involved in libya one of the things that it has said all calls for is the withdrawal of foreign fighters from all of libyas territories i mean that are a lot of foreign fighters on both sides of this conflict. Well a lot of foreign fighters definitely from day one that have to back tripoli back in april last year. His force is a combination of multi not and of international mercenaries were talking about not just the general would from sudan and chad the end mercenaries were talking about a very important component of vaclav medicine is the Russian Special forces vice versa some 1600. 00 of them who are have to use and used to drive back to ripley and they have been at that into police for the last 14 months and its only a month ago that the g. N. A. T. We managed actually to dislodge dont push them back and at the end theyve decided to withdraw them and weve seen the withdrawal of dividing those through town hall and ben you were lead it was obvious to everybody on the ship them out in plain sight to you from possibly maybe later on somewhere and so so declaimed that have to have a proper army libyan National Army is a is a fallacy this is is it is force is that it is just. Complete nation of local militias and regional and international militias and this is a 2 man is it a jump in there because i just need to ask how strong the g. N. A. S. Fighting forces are because its clear that its been the Turkish Military intervention that spurred on these latest military battlefield victories and a lot of fighters that have been hardened battle hardened in syria have been joining the fight so if they were to depart how strong with d. N. A. Be without them. What lets remember. C. C. And have to admit a lot of this turkish involvement because that ultimate correlation and all that lets remember that from april 4th 2019 and till january of this year almost 9 or 10 months there was turkey was not on the scene at all daydream and we signed with turkey was on the 27th of november the implementation of that agreement started early this year so what will do or not the 1st 910 months a thought and then turkeys support mystical support military support. Equipment and drones and so on started to come in and obviously it made a difference but to say that from day one half there was fighting the genny which is heavily backed by fighters and army and military support from turkey as it is a fallacy and at the same time egypt when it talks about withdrawing foreign fighters or foreign groups it totally disregard the vibe lot of the chat audience and also it is usually all personal military advisors and support as well as long and also that other mercenaries i mean the pilots from serbia from a cranium from belarus from below and so on so you know if thats why when we say about this initiative its totally one sided it totally ignores what house there is doing his attack on tripoli since since since 14 months ago and what was egypt all these 4 months is in is it a coincidence that egypt called egypt has never ever called for a ceasefire until yesterday ok the coincidental let me just jump in because it was called by sisi but lets not forget that there was the french the italian russian and u. S. Envoys all at that cairo announcement there are a lot of players in the libyan conflict did the 2 they all support this call for a ceasefire for the 2 sides to get back to a new u. N. Sponsored dialogue. Im not sure that they do it certainly francis made his position pretty clear that it supports the current decoration of the italians now speaking of the europeans seeing the italians were represented there in cairo but i havent seen any message of support for the declaration itself i think they were more there in terms of being an observer dont forget the italians have. Been a supporter of the t. N. A. In tripoli for other reasons and military wants a whole quite some time now so that is a problem in europe so we have 2 major European Countries sponsor on the one italy on the other taking different positions on this conflict which is made it difficult for the e. U. Itself to company with some sort of he said or should have already still contribute more effectively to peacemaking we need to continue to work on that in europe if the europe is going to play its part in europe does its pop lead no question about it in the whatever the solution will be let in solution no military solution to all of this as mr hatters discovering at the moment one thing though on the current climate as a story. I dont imagine that the cairo declarations going to make any difference as the current current event is a concern but sooner or later that matter has to be dealt with far too many boots on the ground from different interests and Different Countries fighting in the area and so long as they are out there it will be extremely to anybody United Nations or any particular country to press forward with a real peace plan libya only is to get to grips with this and its not being given the chance to do so what else does it need what tools does it need to get those feiss out to to move forward on it on its own terms. I think much will depend now on what the cio decides to do that. Much as though they will press forward almost certainly they will take set once they are taken they are then going to have some difficult decisions to make in tripoli as to where next do they press articles going to these of course was to happen to support in these fragile maybe there are alternatives there are maybe some people who would welcome an intervention tripoli on the other hand i would expect there to be a large much broader scale if indeed the offensive pushes forward at that point once they hear that so you can set. The jna mind decide then in conjunction with its supporters itself to try to once again return to the terrible difficulty there is going to be trust. The trust an actor himself and the people around him is near 0 mostel what money will speak as they go down the well so here are the 2nd general meditations visit last year there in moscow and this is the table telling to sign moscows the mourners agree to the cease fire agreement theyre dealing with mr hat is going to be very very difficult but that i think is going to be the next year after after the final set is over jai expect the g. N. A. T. When ok and i think that is absolutely full of 14 or so that says what is the d. N. A. s plan is it to keep pushing forward to keep going into the east to try to take all of the libya and try to unite it. Well i think sarah said it many times that the d. N. A. Which is the legitimate government recognized by the International Community has the right to extend its control over the whole of libya so yes we have now pushed have to out of the whole of the west sort of broadly going to be completed soon then we have you for all we have the south after school to roll over the south is very very loose and i think lloyd is that will change very quickly and we have another very important junction which is the oil crescent have that has grows down the oil crescent and and stop stop and hold the oil export libya depends entirely on oil exports for revenue which base salaries and base subsidies for food and for fuel and for essential Services Like medical services and others and now the close of the oil crescent by half that is causing how to chip a lot of pressure social and economic pressures on the libyan population so the genie has every right to liberate those the earth because of the regime as well and take control of the oil fields in the southwest of libya so that oil countless again so that avenues can start again so that the hardship of the libyan population and the west and the east and the south can actually be eased this is a legitimate right and the n. O. C. Which go towards the oil sector in libya then i slowed corporation which is part of under the under the control of the g. N. A. T. Has every right to be in control of the oil sector again this is according to the resolutions by the National Security and the whole International Community recognize that and you see it should be and i know you will not comment on it i. Have to lose control of those oil fields in the in the oil president. Well there will probably be fired to back him by one way or another there sure is there are limits to the d d to the minister the capacity just does not have a good record in terms of medicine he thinks that hes actually not that good in the last in the century and the last one or more c. Or whether its counterinsurgency or convention office. So that it is a vision issue there was a will for the political record of whether mr hastert or his backers. Are not that great either so we connected specifically. We had to. Leave constantly nagging on the political process and we know that supporters are different types and that is a famous site that they are some for this and i think he fits that category for us and thats the problem with making these i think its if this if it were to be done this would probably be done but with other forces in the in the theres another issue with you to fair to about the. Growing cities we have to remember the i. D. P. s life or the internally displaced persons theres about over 100000 of them in the west were displaced on places like these guys the. Other towns and cities and many of them are actually fighting the feeling that so given the fires and to be out on the harvest how would that affect the other cities that hes a siege specially with tribes are very large like the lava flows in that these all those. The that this cycle where this is mainly a city shift. Of some point one of the again egypt in the you you were fired to make sure that this law is already in line with the project in the form of or another. Although im going to jump on that weve got one minute left and just in that last minute i want to get an idea from james as if the situation on the ground in libya and with all of them suffer play of his sister is another for a turning point in the be a right now. Najera i dont think so no im afraid that it looks as if were going to see more military action for a little while to come through i dont want to marry her or. What is not another year or more country or southern us i was there in 2000 the last year a couple of times and i saw myself well really because the better very courageously overthrew a brutal dictatorship and theyre still suffering now and i mean all of the west wherever they are so we have to hope that it wont go on for too long but i dont think the military story is yet over as i say a lot will depend on the attitude of the general and of course the average principal backers charlie and russia in particular and can europe get it together to join him and play a more active role the question for European Countries is ok well on that note for latin leave it there for today many thanks to all our guests for joining us james moran omar sure and jim a good math and thank you to very much for watching you can see this program again any time by visiting our web site thats aljazeera dot com and a further discussion to go to our Facebook Page thats facebook dot com for slash a. J. Inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter our handle is at a. J. Inside story from me nora brennan and the whole team here if i found out you are. Played what role protecting human life. Not to touch face. Told to old sarah. Let me ask you how worried you are about the increase in hostilities in yemen we listen this is the moment to stop all military action this is the moment to concentrate on fighting we meet with global news makers and talk about the stories that matter on the old a 0 on counting the cost a special report from iran covered 9. 00 has done what you were sanctions failed to bring the countries marketplace to a near standstill what despite the highest death toll in the middle east the government has shifted focus from saving lives to save the economy counting the cost on aljazeera. Its the u. K. s biggest hospital with eventual capacity for 4000 covert 19 patients built inside a London Conference Center it took just 9 days to construct with the help of Army Engineers dramatically expanding the Critical Care bed count and other similar sites on the way the actual london numbers could be much higher than advertised researchers say that huge gaps in Testing Capacity that the government is now trying to close extrapolate that across the country under spread of coronavirus appears far wider than anyone thought. Unprompted and uninterrupted discussions from our london broadcast center. On aljazeera. 1200 hours g. M. T. Here on aljazeera im come all santamaria and these are the headlines they speaker of libyas parliaments the one based into brooke is in moscow for talks this comes as forces of solace ally the. After losing ground so the un recognized government they continued their push towards the strategic city of sirte after had announced a cease fire on the weekend that though was rejected by that government in tripoli but that china has more for us now hes another green which is about 140 kilometers west of sirte
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