Im lebanon to hong kong haiti to the u. K. People are out on the streets demanding change the issues are many problems russian and the Climate Change so as global protests appear to be on the rise we ask whats driving these demonstrations and this is inside story. Hello and welcome to the program im Richelle Carey people in different parts of the world are increasingly expressing their discontent with our governments policies its impossible these days for us to report the news without mentioning a protest somewhere in the world many of the specific issues may be different but there are common themes at the core corruption and justice Climate Change human rights are testers for challenging authorities even in places where it was once considered unthinkable to do so but just as the demands are varied so are the outcomes some have found success through their campaigns others have not and governments are divided on how to address what appears to be a global phenomenon of protest movements. Closer look at some of the protests that are happening right now and lebanon crowds are calling for a complete overhaul of their government angry over a crumbling economy hong kong has experienced months of protests against what seen as a growing influence from beijing and catalonia days of marches have consumed the regions streets as the pro and anti secession movements make their voices heard in chile sudan haiti and around the world people are angry and theyre out on the streets i dont i will slow i am for the reforms i am against the destruction of lebanon lebanon has been badly damaged by the politicians for 30 years today there are thrones are shaking i am with the reforms and early parliamentarian elections you would think that was if you have a little bit of morality a little bit of nationalism if you have a little bit of love for the country then please hand over the keys because the people cant stand it any longer asking you to step down step down let the people go we cant take it any longer i think if this is the silicon and social injustices everywhere the minority concentrates hold the wealth this is about how the robot in supermarkets in health care how they profit with our pensions and there have been some a store protest over the past 10 years the arab spring of course took place in 2011 it shook the foundations of countries across north africa and the middle east and the u. S. The killing of an unarmed black man triggered nationwide marches that gave rise to the black lives Matter Movement and 2014 an uprising in ukraine altered the course of that country the recent yellow best move in in france and bricks of protests in the u. K. Seek to do the same and Latin America Corruption and struggling economies have triggered mass protests in brazil in venezuela and earlier this year a Global Climate strike rallied support from millions around the world. Lets bring in our panel now joining us and winchester the u. K. Matt clemente senior lecturer in the department of applied social sciences at the university of winchester and berlin john betty skull open a sociologist to receive a doctorate from Yale University earlier this year and in lancaster also a new k a melinda a senior lecturer in the department of politics philosophy and religion welcome to all of you matt ill start with you is it just us or does it seem like that there has been a decade of protests and that the numbers really seem to be increasing at least over the past year or 2. Has been a decade of protests as you said really did 2011 was when it kicks off in a quite a big scale not just in the arab world but also your search of protests in greece in britain over pensions in france exception in the occupy movement in spades so that was quite a quite a big time in america of course and that was quite a big start to it but really its only continued since then. What is one of your observations been is it seems that that every week every month every week there is a new protest and it seems to be varied in its locations theres not a continent it seems that hasnt been touched by this. Yeah i think its typical of protest movements to come in waves i mean in europe experience you see it in 48 and there is an emulation aspect to these movements people see. Other countries are going for these movements and they start you know following the example but i think if you look at what events events unfold at a national level. Its a lot of the time has to do with informal movements and you know the traditional conventional wisdom in the social science studies this is that the social Movement Organizations proceed 1st back meeting resources or they see a political opportunity and then to jump in but what you see actually is and you love these cases people react to an event that really causes indignation and anger and this 1st kind of explosion of unrest then encourages people to take for their actions so this is what you see right now in lebanon with. This decision by the government to tax whats up calls which really symbolized i think the iniquity of the lebanese government and prompted a number of people to go on the streets and very quickly the dynamics change and the protest movement takes life on its own and has a great point on the window at id like your thoughts on that too is there some sort of commonality when it comes to. A Tipping Point that really pushes people out in the streets obviously for varying countries in oh theres always different. Underlying issues that perhaps have bubbling up but is there a Common Thread when it comes to a Tipping Point where people to say im not taking this anymore. Well at the heart of this debate are the heart of this undertaking what we have is something called if you see it crossed it will no longer trusting their governments people are no longer saddened that whatever the government is doing on their behalf is for their good and that is one of the reason why people are coming out into the street so the Tipping Point that youre talking about is when people realize that they have to take things onto their own hands to make that change to bring about their transformation and that is exactly what were witnessing from hong kong to. Equal draw from our spring to what is happening now in chile so there is not only the deficit to trust but people also feel that they can bring about their transformation they do not need that government they do not need the Office Operators who bring about their plans for medicine so that belief in the power of their own self belief the Community Spirit is properly this womans to the forefront that we have been witnessing in the last one decade or so that you nodding to that when he said death it is a deficit. Of trust and that that being the Tipping Point but when you talk about a deficit of trust what are the types of things that contribute to that thats got to be a really extreme thing for people to to feel like theyre theyre almost in a loan and the governments not in it with them. Absolutely but i think thats the point that extremism or radicalism is becoming more mainstream becomes a more normal option for many people to take perhaps in the past would not have considered it this is because the existing arrangements were terra calley told the extreme center talking about the marketplace politics of their liberalism which conduct governed. Economic regimes in all parts of the world is failing the majority population in whichever country you talk about serve thats whats led to the loss of face and then as the last week it was saying as the momentum of getting involved in street protests that masses of people getting together i believe that getting organized is a crowd starts to change the consciousness of those people involved you only have to look at some large hong kong what began as a protest simply about. A threatened dangerous sex traditional but now many of the young people are talking about a revolution in hong kong and ive really expanded that monster thats come out of the experience of of qana fighting together on the streets and organizing together on the streets of that process itself has changed that the people themselves as i realize that you know youre not necessarily an expert on on hong kong specifically but you know these issues and im glad you brought that up because i think that one thing that has been really striking about hong kong is the length of these protests and the intensity really seems seems to be there they seem to be extremely organized what are some your observations about the protests in hong kong in particular. Yes i think its been a remarkable level of coordination that you can see the imagination that people show when you look at the ways in which people discards themselves and mask up in different ways so that they dont get recognized by the on that person security cameras the way that they adjust their tactics to try and make sure that the forces of repression cannot kind of beat them off the streets is very very notable in the hong kong case and i think it is a sign of a growing level radicalization. And then some of the arguments about are with the uncompressed for example prowest and assume simply not true a lot of their complaints been about the policing of this. Thing many of the Senior Police officers actually from the ex colonial regime are ex british Police Officers in fact sorry i think that you know theyre just talking about organizing for their rights and organizing on a massive scale. And some of these look lets go back to 2011 to need said that can kind of be seen as some as something that kind of set all of this off what what worked in tunisia. Well we can talk about the political transition but 1st id like to go back to the question of where really explains these demonstrations and id like to really offer a counterpoint to the side of the chair really all has to do with a lack of trust thing that many countries where people lack trust in their government but that doesnt mean theyre actually go on into the street to demonstrate because most of the time most people just be paid that other people and theyre going to go and protest so there is there is the really important dynamic in protest movements which is when people really are just their expectations when they start to believe that other people are going to go into the streets and in an authoritarian regime as we saw in tunisia and for the arab spring its very difficult because people are afraid of being killed or ending in the given jell so in the settings where protests are often very unusual the mere fact of having a demonstration in itself can contribute to shattering this idea that people have that other people are going to acquiesce to to to power and which is why it didnt mix of protest groups are really crucial and in the case of tunisia because this protest was and president then it also happened to come at a time where social media the influence of social media was really starting to be felt they escalated extremely quickly and they could panic. In the government and ultimately the success i mean the we can talk about the organizers tactics but ultimately the success of a protest movement always has to do with the dynamics of who the target group in the case of the arab spring it was authoritarian regimes and alternately it has to do with its strategic game with you know psychological and social aspect but basically the goal is to convince the target that they have nothing else they can do nothing else but comply and for this and. To see things this way you can understand well issues such as the internal city directory of the target group. Is crucial so in. In syria because the military and Security Apparatus was united by you know sectarian ties and so dominated by whites. They could not envision a situation in which a conceding would actually yelled anything good for them in a manager in tunisia was very different because the military and security approaches was professional and owns the protest reach a certain size they understood that their only option was either to kill a large number of civilians or to turn their weapons against benelli which eventually what happened in the check it happened in egypt so i think the dynamics of we often focus on on the actual protest movement themselves but its very important to take into account the dynamics of the target groups in most cases the state and its elites so im a lot of what about that about when you what does it take for there to to be cracks and the groups that are targeted say that the military you know turning on a leader or Something Like that what is it when these what causes those types of cracks what is what we are we testing at the moment is that the knopf of the false dawn in Human History perhaps in the 21st century ma says feel that they can talk to the apollo without any fear that they can march on the whole world will be watching and they will be taken care of that is exactly what is happening if we talk about nonviolent protests from modest thing to hong kong so that is a big thing because in the past the governments code modern what was happening in 91 to them and square when you have that long individual who was standing in front of the marching tank and he was mowed down so if you look at 90902019 almost 30 s. K. Decades we see a sea change happening here. So governments are much more courses as to how you can behave in a military and let me ask you something about that though and i see what youre saying that the protesters feel like you know that if we can get the eyes of the world on us maybe that will give us some level of safety but does that actually in some cases just force the government to use different tactics i mean people get disappeared all the time in jails. Well i mean i can be religious an example is too close to expire for the quitter and have the government of lenin moreno undertook some austerity measures which was a part of the new liberal program of course and people went out into the street the government had to change the capital from quito to go and kill and the whole thing went on for 2 weeks finally the International Community that is united listen something Roman Catholic charge to intervene on behalf of the masses the Indigenous People and the government finally had to give in in terms of sort of pulling back on the austerity measures that return introduced so i would serve it is people who are taking this cost important responsibility seriously so if hong kong protest has been a success so far it is because of cost and quality and responsibility that has come when we have support from all the powers or the masses or who the was so that is something that we havent in the past unfortunately that has given though im nice and peaceful protest movement has succeeded because of that matt let me ask you when we were talking a lot about hong kong because its been such a long as such a sustained movement but part of the hong kong tactics has been i guess you could say this extreme civil disobedience i mean at one point the airport was partially shut down is its disrupted trains when when movements take life when they take hold and do they have to plan for not for lack of a better word ticking the public off at some point. Well i think initially speaking theres often a tendency just saying can we find a middle path allows allow some degree of compromise that doesnt push things right to the edge because initially protesters are often worried about alienating a passive majority that havent yet joined on the streets who they want at least supporting them if you know lots of young activists at least possibly maybe actively supportive and 7 initially maybe the suppression towards moderation but as us protests saw become sustained and they grow in momentum potentially more people join and also like i said people can see that possibly those moderate options dont really work for them and you know if you think about the Extinction Rebellion movement thats been popping up all over the globe at the moment against Climate Change you know that is a recognition that theres this very very little fight in any Institutional Capacity to deliver resul even if that capable no willingness to do the reform and therefore its only by the people acting and demonstrating in powerful ways that the pressure can be brought to bear they believe. That the protests that weve been seeing over the past decade they have been in dictatorships and authoritative. Regimes and democracies as well what. Does it take more for people in a democracy to actually go out and protest because maybe they have. A fight in a functioning democracy that is because they have a sense of comfort i mean whats the the difference that motivates people in those different types of situations. Well i think you know i think the barrier for you know the fresh field for activism is much higher in you know 310 sitting because the risks of of you know being killed or being flown in jail which is much more important obviously i think the biggest challenge that demonstrators have to face in democracies is that at the protests are routine ised we have a series of laws that are low protest in a certain conditions and as a result they do not reprise isnt political craziness most of the time they are just part of the normal life of a democracy and as a result they really fail to create among the target group the government most of the time the feeling that there is there is an extraordinary set of events that they need to react to which is why the strategy of occupying spaces which is ugle in most im a christian which started with occupy wall street and we see now with extensive Extinction Rebellion is actually a very efficient because it breaks this understanding that the protest movement is just like another protest movement and thats crucial i think to foreseeing government needs to consider the possibility that it will have to compromise and id like to go back to the point that you you d roached with the other guest regarding what prompts cracks authoritarian sitting. I think leaving the case of hong kong aside because its its a kind of of a foreign occupying power in most authoritarian settings what prompts cracks within the military and Security Apparatus is really a Critical Mass of demonstrators in a capital city you know if it happens in a pro provincial town its its a regional rebellion if its a small protest in the capital city it doesnt really frighten the regime once you have a Critical Mass of people in the capital city it creates the possibility it if it sees it sows doubt among members of the military and Security Apparatus that the regime is going to survive and owns this study that the regime is going to survive then they start to consider the possibility that they will not obey orders and the last. Of the military and Security Apparatus start to doubt that they will obey orders then exam self open to the possibility of a rebellion and when the rebellion starts to meet lee the worst is a civil war between loyalists and rebels or which encourages under some conditions a physicist to actually tag along with the rebellion even if they dont particularly dislike the regime so there you have a kind of complex a game of anticipation within to the government which i think makes this moment extremely sensitive to 2 small incidents and small events that can tilt ok that action of the country as a whole ok let me bring in a melinda to this in and democracies. Can a vote be considered a protest i mean for example voting you know for bracks it could that be classified as as a protest vote. Yes you can when you are talking about bringing about the change the transfer mess and a regime change if we talk about then we can say that it is a form of protest but it is a protest that bill gavin to the citizens to bring about a new government every 4 years of ideas of what about maybe the dump but your protest implies that you are so dissatisfied that you are on happy with the current regime so it is happening within that specific time sponsor lets say 5 years so that is the reason why you want either to change the government so that a new government can come in and pick up from where you had started or you want to get rid of every on certain things that you are facing at the moment so yes it can take place in a democracy through a Voting System but what we are witnessing is that that ability or that space or that process is not enough to plenty of people in different places and if there is a reckoning that things are not going to change if we are going to have more of the same in the next 4 years next 5 years or what are you that a leads to a certain sense of exist but isnt a certain degree of disillusionment and that forces individuals to go to the streets and it could also become a part in a democratic process where they realize that the government is not going to do anything because its hands are tied or the International System is such that it is going to undermine the masses now lets talk about what is happening in chile i just pick that has been a chorus moment and because because the government has taken some austerity measures and people are out in the streets people have been killed that have been lynching that have been part bomb attacks factories have been set on fire why is that happening it is happening because the government is forced to take a some stand which the masses find on palatable so to cut a long story short it can take place within a democracy by changing voting the area but the same time and people feel that they dont have any other choice the feel that they have to come out into the streets. Ok were just about out of time but im going to try to get in one more quick question to you matthew. Is is income inequality driving a lot of whats happening i believe its having a very significant effect because it its unavoidable its not just that sense of injustice that comes from seeing the gap getting bigger and bigger between rich and poor but you know so many Public Services that people rely on are considerably being privatized all plans to private charge them so that you know even if why is that you want to carry on why is that people think well id rather just continue with my life as it is and not protest i find that the avenues constantly cutoff up for example guard to grading the quality of the hospitals i mean and i would argue certainly in the british cases grading of so many aspects of our Public Service use of austerity which created the bitterness which in the end led to it coming out in the end of it to leave in the 2016 referendum and then all the kind of political shock waves that continued in the country since then matthew that will be the last word. Gentlemen thank you all for joining me for this discussion and i appreciate it very much at the call met and then im a lindo misra and thank you for watching you can see the program again any time visit our website aljazeera dot com for further discussion on our Facebook Page thats facebook dot com forward slash a. J. Inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter our handle is at a. J. Inside story or me Richelle Carey the entire team here in doha by for now. Rewind returns with new scenery. And brand new updates on the best of bounties ynys documentaries if i would compare the 2 onion we havent done in the 3 to spot since the hug then this is the company this is the old city rewind continues with motown to greytown be in al here in the soil learning about health by eating good its train my wife i cant imagine doing Something Else on aljazeera we know the culture we know the problems that affect this part of the world very very well and that is something that were trying to take to the rest of the world we have gone to places and reported on a story that it might take an International Network for months to be able to do it United Nations peacekeepers are out there going im tired and old. We are challenging the forces were challenging companies who are going to places where nobody else is going. To deal with poverty unless you deal with the gap you decide oh i disagree with that toy this sounds like blaming the public the country for the art and then all of the naming anybody these people are well trained as much a part of all of the Islamic State machinery as the more we have been very and the inspiration of populism those are to you to join me in the hot sun as i put it up for questions to my special guests and challenge them to some straight talking political debate here on aljazeera. Hello im just with the headlines on aljazeera turkeys president rush of talk about iran is in such a way hes meeting his russian counterpart at iran has repeated his threat to restart the military operation against kurdish fighters in northeast and syria a cease fire there is expected to end choose day meanwhile Bashar Al Assad has called the president utter one a thief he made the remarks during a visit to areas of it in a province that have been taken from Turkish Backed rebels by Government Forces now iraqs military says u. S. Troops who crossed over from syria do not have permission to stay in the country the soldiers are part of those forces who withdrew from Northern Syria as the takesh operation against kurdish fighters began the pentagon says the aim is to bring u. S. Troops back home and not for them to stay in iraq interminably however the u. S. Secretary of state has indicated that washington is still prepared to take military action in the region if requires where we see American Interest at stake or fundamental norms around the world that need to be enforced will use all the powers that we have you suggested the economic powers that weve used will certainly use them well use our diplomatic powers as well those are our preference we prefer peace to war but in the event that kinetic action or military action is needed you should know the present trump is fully prepared to undertake that action protesters in lebanon are demanding more reforms despite the government approving sweeping economic measures to improve the economy or the already is appear to be tightening security as police and military dispersed protesters trying to erect barricades correspondent stephanie decades in b. Plus with the latest. We
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