Stories on our website on aljazeera dot com back with more in thirty minutes next its inside story do stay with us. As thousands of rogue engines seek refuge in bangladesh a new armed group is taking shape fighting the government and me and mom can only attack them because they refuse to give us our basic rights as citizens but for the first time a member of the ira can just Salvation Army talks to aljazeera at this time. The party of Nelson Mandela turns one hundred and six south africas ruling a. N. C. Is marking this anniversary with a pledge to rebuild itself from deep divisions and accusations of corruption but can the new leadership soul the many challenges the a. N. C. Faces this is inside story. Hello there and welcome to the program im laura cottle south africas governing a. N. C. Is one of the oldest political movements in africa it was founded in one thousand nine hundred twelve has been the dominant policy since the end of apostates in one thousand nine hundred four but the body that promised to bring prosperity to millions of South Africans has been accused of corruption and mismanagement its new lead us around the poses says he wants to change that hes promised to restore credibility to an organization that was once led by Nelson Mandela is he up to the task well put that to our guests in just a moment but first tanya page reports from the a. N. C. Is one hundred sixth anniversary celebration in the eastern cape unique t. V they represent two different visions of the African National congress its past and its future one a space of hundreds of corruption charges and was booed by the crowd. Is riding high after winning the a and cs top job. Is going to head. Several of his first major public appearance as the n. C. S. New president to inspire while making them a bowed references to his predecessor the movement has become deeply divided. Through corruption and competition for sources. If the boos made president jacob zuma uncomfortable he didnt show it they were not listening to the people what they believe in the world is what it really is a little but hes not going to say that the president to try it was a lot of fuss over the years. In the new president s vision is to rebuild and renew the party of Nelson Mandela to use new policies including changing the constitution to allow the government to take mostly white owned land without giving compensation and Free Education for poor students to realize the hopes and aspirations of millions of people all of the songs that a celebration had about change the welcoming so wrong a pause right on him to take his place to build unity and in fact there is a whole overriding sense about but after the Party Speculation is rife it they could be a push within the a. N. C. As top structures to force president zuma out of office before his term is up next year that for there to be real change zuma has to go tanya page aljazeera east london south africa. Well lets take a closer look at the African National congress it was founded in one nine hundred twelve are the primary mission of spearheading the struggle for equal rights in south africa introduction of apartheid laws in one thousand nine hundred sixty one was a turning point and see launched as Armed Struggle with Nelson Mandela as commander in chief of this military wing which led to the a. N. C. Being classified as a terrorist group and banned it took thirty years for that ban to be lifted and mandela was released from prison in one thousand nine hundred set the stage for the end of apartheid in one thousand nine hundred four the a. N. C. Won its first election in a new democratic south africa and mandela became the first black president jacob zuma was elected to head the a. N. C. In two thousand and seven before becoming president of south africa but the body is new leader so rama poser has promised to clean up the a. N. C. As image and vigorously fight corruption. Lets bring in our guests now plenty to talk about in johannesburg William Committee associate Professor School of governance of the university of the voices rand in durban macmaharaj a former spokesman for president jacob zuma and also in johannesburg joining us via skype number a junk professor of public law at the university of cape town a very warm welcome to all of you well if i could start with you rob poser has two big challenges here ahead of him one is uniting the a. N. C. Another is fixing the South African economy can hear chief both of these goals. You know its sort of a poser certainly has the skills he has got to experience he has the energy and. The hunger so he can do it but unfortunately you know the challenge is a very very steep chalons because the first thing im trying to unite e. A. And see you know hes inheriting a insidious deeply divided between his supporters and his supporters of jacob zuma now his first real problem is is they can zoom or does not want to leave the state presidency and now if and the longer he is jacob zuma stays in the in the state presidency the more difficult it will be for a porsche to you know to regain that the public trust in the public coffers and also of torture will be undermined so thats his one chance the second challenge is in terms of the economy itself he needs to he store confidence in the economy now jacob zuma in the state presidency and you know the people around jacob zuma word responsible for the lack of confidence in you know in the government itself in the economy so were not seeing the investment were not seeing the jobs being created so jacob zuma is the obstacle so he needs to get out of the state presidency and unfortunately from a pause are there longer jacob zuma stays in the state presidency the less and less what people believe in the autonomous in of and im a poser they will start to think that im a poser is just a you know a puppet you know of. And he is in power in maybe the president but he is not in power ok maggie agree with that that jacob zuma is the obstacle to south africa being able to move forward and is he going to step down any time soon. To a large degree i agree with professor who were there but i have a different perspective in answering your question ok we need to look at what is actually happening in the city two events have taken place the fifty Fourth Congress conference which elected the new leadership secondly which decided on policy positions of the in see that mess decision has been reinforced by the january eighth statement delivered by a president from a party and when we look at those two events i think we need to acknowledge that as we headed for the fifty fourth conference there was a mood of despair both within the a. N. C. And in the country at large since that conference there is a growing sense of hope and the january eighth statement is reinforcing that hope because it is signaled significant changes one in the direction that the a. N. C. Is taking to in the tone three in the approach of the engineers articulated in the january eighth statement as well as the processes that are taking place the leadership of the living the january eighth statement was delivering a statement that was more than a question a statement of from a post it was a statement adopted by the new National Executive elected in december so it is a statement supported by that leadership mixed as it is the diversity that exists in the n. C. The frightening part is the factionalism but the other elements of diversity or the Diverse Communities the classes the fierce sectional interests that are housed within the a. N. C. Is very normal for the n. C. I so want to pick up on the point that the longer the stays in power as president the weaker is what you agree with that. I think that statement has ability but it should not be made the anchor of the way forward i think that president zuma has to go the issue is how he goes and when he goes and the issue of how goes is also dependent on whether he would be able to rise to be occasion and put the interests of the Country First the second issue is when he goes yes i agree the longer it takes for him not to step down the more difficult it becomes but i am clear i think that the processes that are taking place indicate quite clearly that president hu much time is up and he will soon be out of power and its only a question of how he goes and when he goes ok lets bring in number any so that jacob zuma was booed at these anniversary celebrations the people are clearly fed up with his leadership how do you think he is going to exit this position as president its very important. State a front its one of the president s my own. Is no longer up to him hes going to go and he can choose whether he wants all you know men or that allows him to. Do to have the status of being in a president and and all of the pets that come with it or whether in fact he wants to be impeached so will the islam and i dont disagree with her its insane but more. Presidency. Is not central to the way for action. And so it just has them. Its presence and a whole lot of people. How will he goal i think that a number of people are trying to convince us that it is possible to get so much to leave peacefully and allow him the didnt see that. Theres a different view to that its important to also acknowledge that apparently the illegal cases that. Thats. And those are not going to go away so its important to separate the decision of the cd and the decision of the country so whatever that decides the countrys court and the country is judicial system and the countrys citizens have a say in votes and that is outside of the instance ok a number but he says right doesnt mean the same it is central to this simply because the a. N. C. Is so divided i mean its almost half and half in the support the zuma camp and support for the run oppose a camp right up to the top leadership it appears to me that we are looking have a little bit because theyre in it to look at a huge set of challenges facing for around a portal. Lets lets be very clear fixing the economy rests on eight huge challenge it is growth with transformation you cannot have Growth Without transformational africa and you cannot have transformation without group so its not a simple question as in other countries simply growth number two we have poverty we have inequality we have joblessness and we have joblessness in a World Economy where the Fourth Industrial Revolution is acceptable ating the joblessness and so and we have the corruption but as important for me in the decisions of the a. N. C. Is the capacity that we have lost we have failed to create a professional Civil Service we have a spliff service at the moment where director general change almost overnight so that there is no institutional memory there is a major fault line in the way the a. N. C. Has got to learn its lessons from the project two years of governance and that is to ensure that we have a systematic process of implementation ok what is being signalled here from the president in the genuine statement is a determination to attend to those problems so president zuma is going for me is a given right ok i dont know the divide out the policy of giving Free Education to poor students but how does that marry up with one opposes vision which is to attract foreign and bastards can you do that on the one hand while some dressing inequality on the other. It absolutely you know im a poser has a deadline so you know he doesnt have time and this deadline is next years the twenty nine thousand National Election this is deadline now what he needs to do is kenny in the space of his you know under a year now or kenny produce growth and kenny produce transformation at the same time as mr maher adds has said now in order to get groat one has to grows to do transformation you cant do transformation without growth and from a pause or two to do you look to get growth going you have to get the confidence of investors you know internationally and locally and of ordinary citizens beyond the a. N. C. Thats this is a real challenge now the problem is you know the zuma group was in control of the states now and in control of half of the a. N. C. Most of them really dont care about growth what they want to do is to safeguard themselves from possible prosecution and to hold on to their positions and that is the stumbling block for ram our ports are you know he needs to get to growed but you know the stumbling block is actually inside the a. N. C. Itself and must assume or so he needs to take in this firstly get mr zuma out of the governing space and then take control of government appoint his own people so we really can get a a confidence pounds so that the markets can response you know local business can. Respond and so on so that that really is his challenge now that this zuma group has gone for populist policies you know lie for example you know taking land where are without compensation are what there does that undermines confidence ok and that really is the problem then so or. Where i am a pause i will have to work against a big part of his party debts you know because some of the policies from the zoom are going to coming from this remarkable very popular spot of absalom that my and rama poses over strategy you know to support given for the i see your point there number any so how does rather pose a gain confidence is it by as he says he will confronting corruption on all forms and in order to do that does he then have to have a purge of the a. N. C. Which is going to create a huge number of enemies well firstly. You will miss the migrants would like to minimize the fact that our presence. Is critical in this because thats part of how you build confidence as long as South Africans and people in the ward see president zuma in the position that he used in that theyre going to feel but nothing has chance of us thats the thats the thats the first the secondly the policy. You know and the incidents and says come up with a number of the solutions one is education is the belief are not well thought out position because a lot of the moment. Is in a states that is not levy able to make such there and saw it was it was you know we kind of ran away from the fact that it was the populace a persons mind to actually make that announcement and he meant it will cost a lot a lot of money and a lot of questions as to where that money was some front lawn. The second that they dont want this and the one that is very important is one on lens. There is serial resumption on lens does not say that there will be then its location necessarily wins out if the population compensation it serves that is faster it can look at the pollution of the land within such into five of the constitution so it is very important to make them so what that was all she chose to do is to balance the populists as well as that as as as people are much more realistic because they know that the Constitutional Court is not in fact going to endorse that because the number up most of all right. So if we then have a ram oppose that tackling corruption is that something that he can and will do will this make a crucial difference for south africa when if he doesnt have a quote option in the seat or if the a role concretes actions that have been taken in this temple corruption to get people to account for what they have and will have prosecution where it is necessary to ensure that the institutions of state which have been compromised in president zuma has time if you doesnt do that its unfair that is going to be in trouble its not. What there is one student its about what it has to survive sure and matt they dont want to leave over tomorrow never a moment because there is an Interesting Development with jacob zuma he has launched his own corruption inquiry hasnt he in two claims of states looting is that being seen as too little too late lets be very clear the commission that hears and on. Is so far the announcement is in accord with the decision of the Public Protector Thuli Madonsela a report which was endorsed by the courts namely it said the deep Judicial Commission should be headed by a judge who should be selected by the chief justice that has been announced with the agreement of the chief justice what is that issue at the moment is the terms of reference and again the body of opinion is saying that the terms of reference have to conform with the recommendations of the modern sell a report that is how the courts have seen it there is uncertainty about it at the moment but i think we have to acknowledge that the new administration under sort of from a portal has interacted with president zuma and ensured that the Judicial Commission is being established number two president. On the genuine statement which is the any she statement said that he that alone is not enough there has to be invested criminal investigations and prosecutions of people who have benefited and participated in corruption ok said im not asking senator jacob zuma himself he has a marriage that corruption is algis again all were going to set in the president s body is in that position oh well he is an expresident are we going to see him in court being prosecuted to the courts have empowered the Deputy President of the country to appoint the next head of the National Prosecuting authority the Deputy President is president a Deputy President from a post he has that task to do its no longer in the hands of president zuma on that one so that is the next process ok now profile is that president number of even you are trying to delay had something will fail not plan on going to foster like you have done you by the government what im saying that. You are asking whether there will be a time when president president zuma out what books court and. To the charges or allegations of the charges that and im so into that and yes they were and but is no longer in the hands of that even if they signed that president is a must step down there the charges not necessarily be formally now you must understand the number of ways in which this adult who is of africa. If this situation does not want to deal with this there is a provision for kind of prostitution and other. Provision for credible was if you see a lot of citizens action that are fighting for defense of democracy and some of the over there are looking at that option so one way or the other there is no longer in a position to shield president zuma as well as i was if they have missed that are also and anybody else does not want to charge well if the n. P. A. Does not once thats up us. Does not want to charge president zuma citizens are. Actually looking at different options to make sure that president zuma and his opponents have the import that they take responsibility for what they have done to the ok when many people might say that jacob zuma needs to be out of office before the state of the nation address which is in february a is that going to happen and b. Is it going to be done in a dignified way what do you think run opposed to is trying to do. I mean you this is this is a challenge from a poser because ideally for him to so that hes in charge you know to start his reforms in the a. N. C. And starts reforms in government he needs to be you know in chance of the you know of the government by february when we traditionally in south africa has the hope we have to opening of of you know a Political Year and we are governments you know forecasts what is going to do and so on now right now it seems almost impossible that you know jacob zuma will leave the state president said before thats because you know damn of course or not because it is because he is not in full control of the a. N. C. Hes busy in the go see haitink word jacob zuma you know exit strategy for jacob zuma so we can i think safely say that this negotiation may take anything you know anything between between now and most probably even the end of you know twenty and twenty eighteen and of course as i said earlier the longer it jacob zuma stays in the state presidency unfortunately the more it will erode the or totally from a pause and it will make it very difficult for him to introduce his reforms in the party and in the country so my sense is that it is both probably likely that jacob zuma as the state president s is like you to deliver you know the state of the nation address and in february now if that happens im afraid to say from us that im a poor czar it would look as if hes not in charge of a very interesting to watch the leadership of south africa over the next few weeks many thanks today to all our guests for joining us here on inside story william command a mac and number. And thank you too for watching you can see the program again any time by the website this aljazeera dot com and further discussion to go to our Facebook Page thats facebook dot com for slash a. J. Inside story you can also join the conversation on twitter at a. J. Inside story from me laura kyle and the whole team here bye for now. I. On the benefit of people. So they see the important. Witness documentaries that open your eyes. At this time on aljazeera. News has never been more available its a constant barrage that they put every day but the message is a simplistic you have the frame good logical rational person crazy monster and misinformation is rife dismissal and does not well documented accusations and evidence is part of genocide the listening post provides a critical counterpoint challenging Mainstream Media narratives at this time on aljazeera. 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